Bruckner Symphony no. 2

[Richard Tarleton]

OK, pay attention at the back! Let's get this outta the way early on......Bruckner 2 has some unusual structural and other stylistic features, e.g.. the 1st movement exposition on two thematic groups rather than the usual three; but that's a tale for another night...

Jayne, thank you for one of those posts which make following this forum worthwhile - I've printed this one off to keep (neatly folded in my copy of R Simpson).

I'm ashamed to say I neglected 2 (and 1, and the earlier ones) until quite late (having begun my Bruckner career in 1968), listening to it for the first time in the 1872 Carragan Tintner perf - and instantly loved it. Someone subsequently gave me the Giulini Testament version, and I didn't get on with that at all - the movement order just sounded wrong, for a start. I'm about to listen to the Blomstedt, the set having just arrived - I kicked off with 1 yesterday.

I can't help wondering if Pet's issues with this symphony weren't at least in part down to versions, and movement order...you don't mention Tintner, Pet?

3 was my first live Bruckner (Haitink/LPO, 1972) - I've had the Tintner for some time but found the Blomstedt revelatory when I heard it for the first time on Sunday morning. Looking forward to playing that again at my leisure.

[gurnemanz]

As CDs arrived on the scene I started to accumulate AB's symphonies singly - one version of each, carefully considered, based on reviews. Tintner was my choice for No 2 and I have always enjoyed it. To this day I actually hardly know any other recording. The only other version I have is one acquired coincidentally on the big Karajan BPO Symphony box. I cannot clearly remember if I have even played it. Having got thoroughly used to Dr T and the Irish I think I would find it odd to have the Scherzo third and would certainly miss the horn solo at the end of the Andante.

[Beef Oven!]

As CDs arrived on the scene I started to accumulate AB's symphonies singly - one version of each, carefully considered, based on reviews. Tintner was my choice for No 2 and I have always enjoyed it. To this day I actually hardly know any other recording. The only other version I have is one acquired coincidentally on the big Karajan BPO Symphony box. I cannot clearly remember if I have even played it. Having got thoroughly used to Dr T and the Irish I think I would find it odd to have the Scherzo third and would certainly miss the horn solo at the end of the Andante.

I also began my Bruckner (and Mahler) CD collecting with single CDs, but quickly added the Karajan BPO box set. Although I now have a number of Bruckner box-sets, my collection is overwhelmingly individual releases; and continues that way, for example with Venzago, who over about 14 months I’ve steadily added individual releases with #9 being the only one I don’t have. Probably more expensive, but I prefer it that way.

To this day, among approximately 120 Mahler CDs, I only have two complete Mahler cycles, Sinopoli and Bernstein’s Sony (the only two I couldn’t be without).

[BBMmk2]

Amazing stuff from jayne.... !

Also sprach JLW! members take note! Thank you as ever Jayne!

[Barbirollians]

As many will know, for some reason I've had a lot of trouble over the years in getting to grips with the Bruckner 2 when all the others (including Symphony 0) posed no problems whatever.

However, last Sunday I played Jochum's Bavarian RSO recording and really liked it so the struggle is over, I think. Strange how this symphony has eluded me for so long.

It is a terrific performance - my other favourites are the Wakasugi and the VSO/Giulini

[jayne lee wilson]

You can download the Haitink recordings from YouTube if you possess the right tools ... in my case using the Firefox Browser plus installing one of the numerous free 'video downloaders' in its 'Add On' section. If you want to get rid of the accompanying graphics you can then import it into the excellent audio program, Audacity (also free), and export/convert it to one of the main audio formats available.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4dcr_i386c

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHKd4b38rxs

I see Haitink's No 1 is a mixture of versions of the 'Linz version'!

As this Haitink 1st seems to be his 1960s Philips recording, tape hiss and all (uncredited of course ), the youtube details are (as so often) misleading if not downright quixotic. The true original 1866 Linz edition was only published in 1998 by Carragan, subsequently recorded just twice - by Tintner and Gerd Schaller (both excellent). Haitink's is of course 1877 ed. Haas. The 1877 ed Nowak is near-identical, and these are the most frequently recorded. Bruckner made this 1877 revision in Vienna, but the endearing "Linz" name stuck and also the 1866/77 confusion, perhaps partly because Haas reported on the true "Linz" edition but didn't publish it.. As usual see Griegel and Marques, top of the individual discography pages on abruckner.com

[BBMmk2]

Bruckner's 6th, seems to be my nemesis.

[Barbirollians]

Bruckner's 6th, seems to be my nemesis.

Have you tried the Norrington ?

[BBMmk2]

Have you tried the Norrington ?

No I haven't but I will!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

No I haven't but I will!

Excellent plan, Bbm. Bruckner's Sixth has always been a favourite of mine (one of the first of his works, after the Ninth, that really appealed to me) but Norrington's recording was still a revelation! Dramatic, swift and energetic, but also with a gentle, flowing lyricism - I think it's the best recording RN's ever done! Be great to hear what you think of it.

[P. G. Tipps]

Bruckner 6 is a quite extraordinary work even for Bruckner ... it is almost like the composer is letting his hair down (if he had any in the first place) and having a fun time in a temporary break from his much deeper stuff.

Commentators are ever-fond of referring to the composer's 'piety' and 'simplicity', blah, blah, blah, but they often fail to mention that he loved playing the fiddle in pub-bands and was an excellent dancer. Bruckner was clearly a very complicated character which no doubt contributed to his well-documented nervous problems. Doubt if Myleene would 'klass' him as a genius like that dishy young Wolfgang, though ...

Back to the Sixth! I still have a huge soft spot for Solti/Chicago which was my introduction to the work many years ago.

[Beef Oven!]

Bruckner 6 is a quite extraordinary work even for Bruckner ... it is almost like the composer is letting his hair down (if he had any in the first place) and having a fun time in a temporary break from his much deeper stuff.

Commentators are ever-fond of referring to the composer's 'piety' and 'simplicity', blah, blah, blah, but they often fail to mention that he loved playing the fiddle in pub-bands and was an excellent dancer. Bruckner was clearly a very complicated character which no doubt contributed to his well-documented nervous problems. Doubt if Myleene would 'klass' him as a genius like that dishy young Wolfgang, though ...

Back to the Sixth! I still have a huge soft spot for Solti/Chicago which was my introduction to the work many years ago.

Yes, Bruckner was quite a character and doesn’t get the credit for trend-setting that he should. For example, he pre-dated Slade’s Noddy Holder with the trouser length thing, even before Doc Martens had been invented.

My favourite 6 is Celibidache MPO, only the finale not quite maintaining the astonishingly high level of performance that Celi wrings from the orchestra.

I don’t know the Solti.

The long-lauded Klemperer EMI never completely did it for me, I never quite understood why so many raved about it.

I got an excellent steer towards the Norrington (from Bryn, IIRC), but it’s the Celi for me.

P.S. I can confirm that B certainly had plenty of hair in the first place.

[Barbirollians]

Excellent plan, Bbm. Bruckner's Sixth has always been a favourite of mine (one of the first of his works, after the Ninth, that really appealed to me) but Norrington's recording was still a revelation! Dramatic, swift and energetic, but also with a gentle, flowing lyricism - I think it's the best recording RN's ever done! Be great to hear what you think of it.

I agree though I have a very soft spot for his LCP Symphonie Fantastique .

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I agree though I have a very soft spot for his LCP Symphonie Fantastique .

- although he's WRONG about the tempo of the March: any percussionist worth their salt (and at least one who isn't - modesty forbids) can play the opening with one hand at the faster speeds he says are "impossible"!

(Or "can't be done" at the faster tempo - not an exact quotation.)

[Petrushka]

Solti's recording of the Bruckner 6 is very fine indeed and would be amongst my top choices in this work. It was a live performance by Chailly and the Concertgebouw (in Birmingham of all places) that really opened the door for me with the B6. The Klemperer recording has never done it for me either and probably set me back a decade in appreciating what a truly great symphony it is. I'm not totally allergic to Norrington so might well seek it out, otherwise I'm happy with Haitink/Staatskapelle Dresden, Solti/CSO, Wand/NDRSO and Jochum/BRSO. The Sawallisch recording that Caliban raves about is marred, for me, by a slightly too fast first movement.