Chopin

[Guest]

Hello

I am new to Chopin. I never warmed to his Mazurkas, but a disc of Grigory Sokolov playing the preludes live really caught my ear. Encouraged, I gave the famous Pollini etudes a go. Wow! Then I tried Samson Francois in the nocturnes. (It's been a busy few days!)

I was curious what others felt.

Another great find was an Andras Schiff documentary on the Youtube discussing Chopin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-tp...D02VMQsqYzF4Bg

[verismissimo]

Welcome Ruhevoll!

For me, it's Martha Argerich who is without equal in Chopin.

[antongould]

Welcome Ruhevoll!

For me, it's Martha Argerich who is without equal in Chopin.

Yes welcome- Rubenstein has been praised for his FC here before........

[amateur51]

Welcome Ruhevoll!All the aforementioned pianists can be very revealing in Chopin's music but just occasionally I have to listen to performances by Shura Cherkassky who can stretch time like no-one else to great effect.

This boxed set is also a wonder ...

http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Frederick%2BChopin%2BInstitute/NIFCCD000-020

Cheapest here I think but only just

http://www.amazon.fr/Real-Chopin-Complete-Period-Instruments/dp/B004EQAUZQ?SubscriptionId=AKIAIVGTH525N57WM2NQ&tag=galenicom0e-21&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B004EQAUZQ

[richardfinegold]

Try the recordings of Sergei Rachmaninoff, another great composer, who recorded a fair amount of Chopin.
Other recommendations: Etudes--Maurizio Pollini steely brilliance
Preludes--Claudio Arrau
Mazurkas & Polonnaises- Rubinstein

[Richard Tarleton]

A long-dormant thread, but I thought I'd bump it to mention Alan Walker's new biography of Chopin, titled Fryderyk Chopin - A Life and Times - I'm currently on page 443. Fascinating stuff, the musical analysis has set me off on a more systematic exploration of his music than I've done before. And as for the life and times bit, riveting and harrowing. As demonstrated by his 3-vol biog of Liszt, Walker is a great biographer and musicologist.

[cloughie]

Hello

I am new to Chopin. I never warmed to his Mazurkas, but a disc of Grigory Sokolov playing the preludes live really caught my ear. Encouraged, I gave the famous Pollini etudes a go. Wow! Then I tried Samson Francois in the nocturnes. (It's been a busy few days!)

I was curious what others felt.

Another great find was an Andras Schiff documentary on the Youtube discussing Chopin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-tp...D02VMQsqYzF4Bg

Interesting you should start this thread as I was a long time underwhelmed by Chopin, except for the Pollini/Kletzki PC1, and then two things changed my view. As with you Samson Francois - his interpretations add a gallic factor akin to Debussy and the other was through learning to play the piano at my time of life and enjoying trying to play Chopin.

[Bryn]

Hello

I am new to Chopin. I never warmed to his Mazurkas, but a disc of Grigory Sokolov playing the preludes live really caught my ear. Encouraged, I gave the famous Pollini etudes a go. Wow! Then I tried Samson Francois in the nocturnes. (It's been a busy few days!)

I was curious what others felt.

Another great find was an Andras Schiff documentary on the Youtube discussing Chopin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-tp...D02VMQsqYzF4Bg

I would recommend that you at least try some of the recordings from the "Real Chopin" project. Some of us here got the boxed set at very low price, due to a mispricing error, and discovered new, or is it old, delights in Chopin's muse. See also http://www.for3.org/forums/showthrea...7211#post27211 .

[Pianorak]

I never warmed to his Mazurkas

Welcome, Ruhevoll - If you don't warm to these - abandon all hope.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfjn9Ll4eUk&list=RDqfjn9Ll4eUk&start_radio=1&t=9

[Serial_Apologist]

Listening to the closing moments of TTN this morning I was struck by strong resemblances between the central section of the famous Fantasie-Impromptu Op 66, at 1 minute 20 seconds in here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHwhfpN--Bk

and the opening measures of the song I'm Always Chasing Rainbows:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CMSjI-Znc4

The only difference being a semitone - the Chopin piece is in G# major, the Judy Garland song in G, which seems rather suspicious. There was once a thread devoted to music that sounded suspiciously like other music, which I can not now find. I was wondering if anybody else had noted the similarities?

[Ein Heldenleben]

Listening to the closing moments of TTN this morning I was struck by strong resemblances between the central section of the famous Fantasie-Impromptu Op 66, at 1 minute 20 seconds in here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHwhfpN--Bk

and the opening measures of the song I'm Always Chasing Rainbows:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CMSjI-Znc4

The only difference being a semitone - the Chopin piece is in G# major, the Judy Garland song in G, which seems rather suspicious. There was once a thread devoted to music that sounded suspiciously like other music, which I can not now find. I was wondering if anybody else had noted the similarities?

To be honest SA the Garland song is an acknowledged ripoff of the Chopin melody . There’s also Sinatra’s Moon Love a steal from Tschaik 5 . Not sure what key Judy is singing in but in my score the original Largo of the Fantasie Impromptu is in D Flat . I guess they transposed it to suit Garland’s range or because it’s much easier scoring and playing in G than D Flat for the band,

[Serial_Apologist]

To be honest SA the Garland song is an acknowledged ripoff of the Chopin melody . There’s also Sinatra’s Moon Love a steal from Tschaik 5 . Not sure what key Judy is singing in but in my score the original Largo of the Fantasie Impromptu is in D Flat . I guess they transposed it to suit Garland’s range or because it’s much easier scoring and playing in G than D Flat for the band,

I checked and the source stated that the song was written in the key of G. G# major - what a swine of a key to write such a virtuosic piece in! I once asked my dad why he though Liszt had titled his set of piano pieces "Transcendental Studies"; to which he replied, "Well, he called them 'transcendental' because he though nobody but himself had the transcendental technique to be able to play them"!

[Ein Heldenleben]

I checked and the source stated that the song was written in the key of G. G# major - what a swine of a key to write such a virtuosic piece in! I once asked my dad why he though Liszt had titled his set of piano pieces "Transcendental Studies"; to which he replied, "Well, he called them 'transcendental' because he though nobody but himself had the transcendental technique to be able to play them"!

Your Dad was right about the Transcendental Etudes. The dental bit refers to the tooth grinding tedium involved in practicing them. Just to add to the problem there are three different versions. . The Fantasie Impromptu is in C sharp minor ( I have the score in front of me ) and the middle section largo is in D flat presumably because Chopin didn’t want to write that in C sharp major as it’s a difficult key to read off the page. The piece itself is about grade 8 plus and is murdered by amateur pianists on a daily basis who tend to turn the four against three section into a put down the pedal and Hope blur. Most of it lies well under the fingers apart from one tricky descending figuration early on that can only be solved by a lot of practise. An awful lot of pros play it too fast to make it sound like a virtuoso plaything . Big mistake.

[mikealdren]

There was once a thread devoted to music that sounded suspiciously like other music, which I can not now find. I was wondering if anybody else had noted the similarities?

A search for Lloyd Webber might fine it?

[smittims]

Nice one , mike. I was once upbraided for suggesting that Mr LloydWebber composed at one of those keyboards where you pick out the tune with one finger and the software does the harmony for you.

Seriously, though (if we can be ) I've always been fascinated by musical similarities (or 'reminiscences' as they used to be called) and the question of how aware of them the composer was at the time . For instance Brahms' song Immer Leiser wird mein Schlummer begins like the third movement of his second piano concerto (the cello solo passage) . But the passage goes further back than that, to the opening of Joseph Haydn's sonata in C minor , Hob. XVI : 20, which Brahms may have known from his friendship with Haydn scholar Eusebius Mandycewski.

To return to popular songs derived from the classics, I was intrigued by a song whose title I can't recall sung by Randy Newman around 1981*, as it contained interesting harmonic progressions not normally found in pop songs. Eventually I realised that the reason it caught my attention was that it was derived from the main theme of the third movement of Rachmaninov's first symphony , rather a recherche source, I thought.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*I remember the year because it was the same summer England beat Australia after following on in three consecutive matches, a feat not achieved since 1894 in Melbourne S.A.