Carter, Elliott (1908 - 2012)

[ahinton]

Indeed - and I once remember coming across his Harmony Book (either in Bangor University or Birmingham Central libraries) and being very impressed by its exhaustiveness. His charts for works like the Concerto for Orchestra are also very interesting to behold:





(These are photos I've taken from David Schiff's book on Carter).

Anyway I've just ordered a CD with the Boston Concerto and Cello Concerto on (though I have a few weeks to wait) thanks for bringing these works to my attention.

The antiquarian book and music dealer Albi Rosenthal (who introduced me to Carter before the UK première of the middle movement of Sinfonia at the Proms) knew Carter well and was instrumental in enabling many of his scores, sketches and other material to find their way to the Paul Sacher Stiftung in Basel where they remain to this day; he told me that, for Concerto for Orchestra and the Third Strinq Quartet, there were literally hundreds of pages of sketches. I was surprised at this because, whilst I've never been able to come anywhere close to that quartet (on which I fear I've given up after more than 50 attempts!) and it still seems very contrived to my ears, the fit of inspiration that generated the Concerto for Orchestra sounds resulted in such irrepressible spontaneitsy of expression as to convey (at least to me) the impression that the piece almost composed him (if that makes any sense)...

[smittims]

Thanks for reminding me of the piano sonata, Alistair. I must dig out my old LP of Charles Rosen (alias Olsen Archers) and give it a clean and play it.

[french frank]

I remember I think the UK premiere of the Symphony of Three Orchestras at the 1979 Proms. I especially recall John Wallace playing that difficult solo at the start. It was a memorable concert including Lutoslawski conducting his 'Espaces du Sommeil' , also I think its UK premiere and Tippett conducted 'A Child of Our Time '

What a programme - Robert Ponsonby's controllership.

[RichardB]

a fundamentally cheerful view of life, which probably helped him live such a long and productive life.

Coming from a wealthy family and thus never being short of cash probably didn't do any harm either.

[smittims]

I didn't know that, Richard. I see what you mean, but there have been many wealthy, miserable people.

[Pulcinella]

Just realised that I have a recording of the Piano sonata (Peter Lawson, Virgin), so I must give that a spin later.
Will also (re)read the chapter on him in a Twentieth century American masters (Grove) book I have.

[Joseph K]

Just realised that I have a recording of the Piano sonata (Peter Lawson, Virgin), so I must give that a spin later.
Will also (re)read the chapter on him in a Twentieth century American masters (Grove) book I have.

Spinning the third string quartet played by the Pacifica Quartet now. I'm really enjoying it - though I can't pretend to be able to articulate specifically all of its compositional techniques, I grasp some of the general concepts such as the use of polyrhythm and intervals - and importantly the piece works on an expressive level. Oddly enough I find some of the fast ornamental rhythms against slow-moving ones reminiscent of some 17th century instrumental music - actually, I've just looked up the section on this piece by Schiff and it states that this demonstrates some of Carter's most rigorous contrapuntal technique which can be traced back to his training in Renaissance counterpoint!

[ahinton]

Spinning the third string quartet played by the Pacifica Quartet now. I'm really enjoying it - though I can't pretend to be able to articulate specifically all of its compositional techniques, I grasp some of the general concepts such as the use of polyrhythm and intervals - and importantly the piece works on an expressive level. Oddly enough I find some of the fast ornamental rhythms against slow-moving ones reminiscent of some 17th century instrumental music - actually, I've just looked up the section on this piece by Schiff and it states that this demonstrates some of Carter's most rigorous contrapuntal technique which can be traced back to his training in Renaissance counterpoint!

Well, good for you! I just can't get it - and I've heard the Pacifica performance too...

[Pulcinella]

Spinning the third string quartet played by the Pacifica Quartet now. I'm really enjoying it - though I can't pretend to be able to articulate specifically all of its compositional techniques, I grasp some of the general concepts such as the use of polyrhythm and intervals - and importantly the piece works on an expressive level. Oddly enough I find some of the fast ornamental rhythms against slow-moving ones reminiscent of some 17th century instrumental music - actually, I've just looked up the section on this piece by Schiff and it states that this demonstrates some of Carter's most rigorous contrapuntal technique which can be traced back to his training in Renaissance counterpoint!

Bayan Northcott, in the Grove article I've just read, says:

Nevertheless, it was studying a range of material from Machaut to Stravinsky and furthering his command of strict counterpoint in up to 12 parts under Boulanger that proved crucial in focusing his musical understanding and technique.

[Joseph K]

Listened twice in a row to the second string quartet played by the Pacifica Quartet. Enjoyed it quite a lot, or at least to the extent that is possible given the stomach ache that has arisen since late morning.

Now I have the Double Concerto on, The Contemporary Chamber ensemble under Arthur Weisberg. This is a very fine piece that I haven't listened to in ages. For some reason now the harpsichord cadenza reminds me somewhat of some jazz keyboard playing. Also dig the percussion.

[silvestrione]

Just realised that I have a recording of the Piano sonata (Peter Lawson, Virgin), so I must give that a spin later.
Will also (re)read the chapter on him in a Twentieth century American masters (Grove) book I have.

I've heard Peter Lawson play it live...terrific. As is the recording by Claire-Marie Le Guay

[RichardB]

This thread has sent me to catch up on some Carter I didn't know. This morning it was a double CD on the Bridge label, volume 8 of their series of Carter recordings consisting of 16 pieces written between 2002 and 2009. I'm not sure I was aware of this release before, or perhaps it was just that its execrable cover design (even by this label's standards) hurt my eyes too much. I mean, how hard can it be to design an attractive CD cover? I like to think I've done it myself, in a simple sort of way, without any training in graphic design, so what's the problem for a "proper" label?

For me the highlights were these, all performed by the BBC SO with Oliver Knussen:

Horn Concerto - it's a very small genre, but this is an individual addition to it. Amazingly played by Martin Owen. There are things in this horn part I would have thought barely possible to play, but he plays them almost as smoothly as if he were playing a violin or clarinet.

Wind Rose for large woodwind ensemble and Sound Fields for strings are both brief studies in almost Feldman-like slowly overlapping textures, showing that EC wasn't just still composing at the age of 100 but still exploring unsuspected corners of his compositional world.

[Joseph K]

This thread has sent me to catch up on some Carter I didn't know. This morning it was a double CD on the Bridge label, volume 8 of their series of Carter recordings consisting of 16 pieces written between 2002 and 2009. I'm not sure I was aware of this release before, or perhaps it was just that its execrable cover design (even by this label's standards) hurt my eyes too much. I mean, how hard can it be to design an attractive CD cover? I like to think I've done it myself, in a simple sort of way, without any training in graphic design, so what's the problem for a "proper" label?

For me the highlights were these, all performed by the BBC SO with Oliver Knussen:

Horn Concerto - it's a very small genre, but this is an individual addition to it. Amazingly played by Martin Owen. There are things in this horn part I would have thought barely possible to play, but he plays them almost as smoothly as if he were playing a violin or clarinet.

Wind Rose for large woodwind ensemble and Sound Fields for strings are both brief studies in almost Feldman-like slowly overlapping textures, showing that EC wasn't just still composing at the age of 100 but still exploring unsuspected corners of his compositional world.

The cover's ok IMO. Carter with a big 100th birthday cake.

Listening to the Horn Concerto now via youtube.

[RichardB]

The cover's ok IMO.

Really? It's not just the silly photo though, the typography is really messy too, and the colours, and, well, I suppose it's a matter of taste but I find it hideous.

Now: Piano sonata, played by Charles Rosen. I haven't heard anyone else play it as well as he did.

[Joseph K]

Really? It's not just the silly photo though, the typography is really messy too, and the colours, and, well, I suppose it's a matter of taste but I find it hideous.

Now: Piano sonata, played by Charles Rosen. I haven't heard anyone else play it as well as he did.

I guess it could be better, you're right ('hideous' seems like a bit of an extreme description though IMO )

I have the Rosen recording from 1961 (is there more than one?) lined up for listening later... guitar practice beckons now...