Walton, Sir William (1902-1983)

[ahinton]

Not liking The Dambusters' March? One of the best British marches written ever! All British bandsmen knows that! I think that's it with me having been a bandsmen, I am rather partial to those works you have mentioned.Make sure you hear The RAF Central band play them!

Those two once famous Walton marches - Crown and Sceptre and Orb Imperial - have always struck me as such brilliantly crafted subtly tongue-in-cheek parodies of the Pomp & Circumstance "tradition" that I find it hard to stifle laughter when I listen to them; I can almost imagine their scores having been written on pink paper so much more effectively to cock a satirical snook at the ailing "Empaaah"!

"Make sure you hear The RAF Central band play them!"...you omitted "while RAF still has one"...

[Lat-Literal]

Indeed - it wouldn't have bombed in the charts!

Find me the Walton tune that you have seen football fans hum with their arms outstretched on Clapham Junction station.

It might take a while.

Those two once famous Walton marches - Crown and Sceptre and Orb Imperial - have always struck me as such brilliantly crafted subtly tongue-in-cheek parodies of the Pomp & Circumstance "tradition" that I find it hard to stifle laughter when I listen to them; I can almost imagine their scores having been written on pink paper so much more effectively to cock a satirical snook at the ailing "Empaaah"!

"Make sure you hear The RAF Central band play them!" - you omitted "while RAF still has one...

Does this open up a new angle - Walton the humourist? - as in standing on someone's foot. I find his character as much as his music hard to assess. The somewhat nebulous Sitwells, Sassoon, Parry who regarded him as a genius, Elgar who he admired, Schoenberg and Hindemith, Imma von Doernberg (Alexander Freiherr von Dörnberg , possibly not related, was a German SS officer and head of the Protocol Department of the Foreign Office from 1938 to 1945) and Viscountess Wimborne, Ted Heath and British royals.....it is a slightly curious mix.

William Walton, at the age of 79, remembers his childhood:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pStFsmpGTqc

Now I've seen it, this is ok and quite informative - humble origins, Lancashire, upwardly mobile, capable of being moved - but that Olivier comment about him being in appearance and personality very pale and "chill" is, I think, reflected in his music. I disagree with Olivier on that point. My OP mentioned the RAF which I like but it isn't successful for being full of heat. Right from the start, I was sure just on the basis of listening that the principal colour in Walton's music was light blue if not grey. And I haven't changed my view on that idea one iota.

[teamsaint]

Walton was that unusual thing: a 20th century composer of avowedly right-wing politics. He believed in the Patriarch. And I doubt he'd have recognised racism if it fell over him.

https://www.politicalcompass.org/composers

I do happen to think that within any field of activity people tend to not espouse views that go against the norm in that field.

Edit: anyway, Walton, whats not to like.
Has Lat tried the Viola Concerto ? Is this not the most popular work in its field?

[Lat-Literal]

Thank you for the last two posts. Interesting - I have tended in these things to be close to where Mahler allegedly sits, not that I am a Mahlerian. Someway towards the left and almost on the neither-an-authoritarian-or- a-libertarian line. But my musical angle is that any politics are approximate in music unless it's something like overtly political folk music lyrics. The question of racism was mentioned earlier. I feel that it is a fairly modern idea which doesn't translate too easily to much earlier times. Having said as much, it can provide a contextual flavour. There is a certain political outlook in my approach to, say, the music of Wagner and R Strauss. Approximation of the kind I am suggesting might better be described using the example of some South American classical music. Any radicalism that is heard is less to do with hard politics than the culture reflected in it - the weather and the terrain or approaches to dance there may contribute to a sense of vibrancy, irrespective of a composer's policy position if indeed it is known.

On further exploration, I've now been to Façade which beyond posters' comments that it is an early version of rap reminds me, actually, of Betjeman, a poet who I find just about ok. So it is Sitwell's verse but somehow it seems appropriate. Perhaps Walton is to classical music what Betjeman was to poetry? I've also been to the Cello Concerto which I have to admit I find difficult, to Sinfonia Concertante courtesy of Nevilevelis which is probably the piece of music by Walton I like best so far and to In Honour of the City of London whose title could confirm prejudices. I am not sure, though, that it is quite the testament to finance houses one might have thought. I accept that there are a fair few fireworks there but there are also fireworks in Orff's similarly timed Carmina Burana. Fortunately Walton's piece does not have the blousy overblown pomp of Orff, probably because above the not unattractive choral aspects there is unquestionably the chill Waltonian sound of patriotic planes. I will listen to the Violin Concerto etc next.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Walton composed very little music after 1969, the year when his score for The Battle of Britain was rejected and largely replaced by a new version by Ron Goodwin.

This, by Walton, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rR1aDI8qmqw

was replaced by this - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=135xO5xeqf4

Happily, the DVD allows us to watch the film with either score.

The "Battle of the Air" sequence did retain Walton's score in the original cinema version, but only after Sir Laurence Olivier had threaten to pull out of the film.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQJlwrncvA0

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

The "Battle of the Air" sequence did retain Walton's score in the original cinema version, but only after Sir Laurence Olivier had threaten to pull out of the film.

Not quite - he'd already filmed everything he appeared in; he told them that they wouldn't be able to use his name in publicising the film if they didn't use at least some of Walton's score.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Not quite - he'd already filmed everything he appeared in; he told them that they wouldn't be able to use his name in publicising the film if they didn't use at least some of Walton's score.

Walton appreciated the gesture and agreed to score one more film for him, despite saying he would compose no further film music.

[Conchis]

https://www.politicalcompass.org/composers


I do happen to think that within any field of activity people tend to not espouse views that go against the norm in that field.

Edit: anyway, Walton, whats not to like.
Has Lat tried the Viola Concerto ? Is this not the most popular work in its field?

That chart gets it wrong in so many ways.

Although embraced by the far right, Wagner was a leftist for much of his life (until the despotic Ludwig ll solved all his problems. Even so, I don't think there's any evidence that he became a right-winger in later life, as did Verdi).

Tchaikovsky was probably the most right-wing major composer: he was a Tsarist reactionary.

[EdgeleyRob]

I adore Walton's music.
It always sounds as if every note has been really sweated over,nothing wasted,not sure if that makes sense.

I can relate to this Lat

It gets trickier when a composer had a significant place in history and I feel I'm missing something

I'm the same with Sibelius and Nielsen,but as time goes on I become less bothered

[teamsaint]

That chart gets it wrong in so many ways.

Although embraced by the far right, Wagner was a leftist for much of his life (until the despotic Ludwig ll solved all his problems. Even so, I don't think there's any evidence that he became a right-winger in later life, as did Verdi).

Tchaikovsky was probably the most right-wing major composer: he was a Tsarist reactionary.

Actually, I should have put a disclaimer in my post, as I really put it up as a discussion point.

[LeMartinPecheur]

I'm keen on Walton and will never forget singing his Coronation Te Deum as a student back in 1972: a helluva good noise and good, highly memorable piece IMHO. Still not often heard, but really should be.

And a very natural stablemate for the other work in that '72 programme, Faure's Requiem

[ardcarp]

William Walton, at the age of 79, remembers his childhood:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pStFsmpGTqc

Thanks so much for posting that. An old singing friend of mine appears briefly in the back row of CCO choir...a lay clerk (yes they had some) not a choral scholar. Mrs A and I were chuffed to see him looking so young...and with an early 70s haircut!

Walton was that unusual thing: a 20th century composer of avowedly right-wing politics

Not so rare in the 21st, maybe.

[Serial_Apologist]

Thanks so much for posting that. An old singing friend of mine appears briefly in the back row of CCO choir...a lay clerk (yes they had some) not a choral scholar. Mrs A and I were chuffed to see him looking so young...and with an early 70s haircut!



Not so rare in the 21st, maybe.

Capitalist realism, as Richard and I would describe it.

[Beef Oven!]

Capitalist realism, as Richard and I would describe it.

You guys an item?

[BBMmk2]

I'm keen on Walton and will never forget singing his Coronation Te Deum as a student back in 1972: a helluva good noise and good, highly memorable piece IMHO. Still not often heard, but really should be.

And a very natural stablemate for the other work in that '72 programme, Faure's Requiem

That Coronation Te Deum would go well with his magnificent Belshazzer's Feast.. I saw that classic Prom performance of Sir Andrew Davis. I am sure RVW's Job was performed at the same Prom as well.