Simpson, Robert (1921-1997)

[Beef Oven!]

Don't forget his music for brass band!

Great shout, BBM

[Beef Oven!]

I'm sure you won't allow that to happen.

So I did listen to his 9th Symphony, and I thought yes indeed, this is all about making an argument and following it somewhat doggedly for a very long time, and that isn't a thing I find particularly attractive in music, especially when it's as rhythmically monotonous as this. I don't agree that "nothing is wasted", I felt that a great deal of time is wasted making sure every point in the "argument" is fully explained so that nobody's in any doubt about what's going on before the next item on the agenda is introduced. There seems to me no room for a listener to use his/her imagination.

To use a Simpson reference, I don't know a rising 5th from a rissole, so I can't follow any argument or understand whether anything is being wasted or used well. I just enjoy listening to it. The final track on the CD is an illustrated talk about the symphony by Simpson. He says that don't need to be a musician to sense whether a piece of music has a certain consistency, but you may not be able to put your finger on the reasons'. He says the talk aims to give some clues, but they won't help anybody if you don't find the piece convincing in the first place. Kinda points to the difference of opinion you and I have on this work.

[LeMartinPecheur]

Please see the group-think re-enforcement thread - you need to be posting there, not here .....

Thank you so much Beefo, it's nice to know you tolerate all opinions

In no way do I claim I'm right and you're wrong. I'm sorry I don't get DS's music and may well keep trying. But not because you shout at me - that of course could very easily prejudice me against it!

[Serial_Apologist]

Thank you so much Beefo, it's nice to know you tolerate all opinions

In no way do I claim I'm right and you're wrong. I'm sorry I don't get DS's music and may well keep trying. But not because you shout at me - that of course could very easily prejudice me against it!

Simpson's music can be rather shouty too, domineering, so there is a possible element of identification. I once used the word "masculine" to describe it on the old BBC forum, and was taken down several pegs. Perhaps "masculist" would have been a better term!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Simpson's music can be rather shouty too, domineering, so there is a possible element of identification. I once used the word "masculine" to describe it on the old BBC forum, and was taken down several pegs. Perhaps "masculist" would have been a better term!

Macho do about nothing?

[Beef Oven!]

Simpson's music can be rather shouty too, domineering, so there is a possible element of identification. I once used the word "masculine" to describe it on the old BBC forum, and was taken down several pegs. Perhaps "masculist" would have been a better term!

C'mon! That says more about you than it does about Rs's music or the people who like it!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

One aspect of the Symphonies that has always struck me as their most impressive feature is the Slow Movements: the way Simpson manages to combine a very strong sense of "architecture" (meticulously thought-out in advance) in Music that sounds as if it is making itself up as it goes along ("improvised") is something that still impresses me, even if my previous enthusiasm for the other Music has (temporarily, I hope) faded.

[Beef Oven!]

Thank you so much Beefo, it's nice to know you tolerate all opinions

In no way do I claim I'm right and you're wrong. I'm sorry I don't get DS's music and may well keep trying. But not because you shout at me - that of course could very easily prejudice me against it!

Huh?

What are you on about?

You said you are finding the thread reassuring and glad of the group reinforcement of your prejudice. I signaled you to the more appropriate thread for such ideas.

[Richard Barrett]

He says that you don't need to be a musician to sense whether a piece of music has a certain consistency, but you may not be able to put your finger on the reasons

And there he is absolutely right, of course; and his own music is extremely consistent. I'm not trying to claim it's "bad" or anything like that, just trying to account for the reasons why it doesn't hold my attention (actually, I have to admit I stopped listening a few minutes before the end of the symphony for that reason), and when I'm talking about such things I hope I can be excused for betraying the fact that I do know a rising fifth from a rissole, but that doesn't mean I'm talking about something different from what someone who doesn't might have to say. Being "musically literate" might influence one's vocabulary but it doesn't necessarily influence one's opinions.

And it would be good to have a conversation about different views of this music without anyone getting defensive! (and/or offensive)

[LeMartinPecheur]

Huh?

What are you on about?

You said you are finding the thread reassuring and glad of the group reinforcement of your prejudice. I signaled you to the more appropriate thread for such ideas.

Exactly how I took it: "Go away and play somewhere else, share with others equally ignorant - I am simply not interested in any less-than-adulatory views about Simpson's music."

Perhaps you should think more carefully about your how your posts on these boards will come over, an idea that has crossed my mind often about other threads in which you have contributed and raised hackles. Not mine personally until today I hasten to add: this is my first time and I hope my last.

[Beef Oven!]

Exactly how I took it: "Go away and play somewhere else, share with others equally ignorant - I am simply not interested in any less-than-adulatory views about Simpson's music."

No, you have completely missed the point. Whether you care for Simpson's music doesn't matter to me at all. What I'm 'not interested in' is posts that seek to feed off others in the group to confirm their prejudices. There's current thread for that. I'm interested in the discussion about the music, not about how you feel re-assured etc.

Perhaps you should think more carefully about your how your posts on these boards will come over .....

Perhaps you might too (have a look at RB's posts for a steer - he has articulated a critical view of RS's music very well, IMO)

[Beef Oven!]

Currently listening to String Quartet No.12 carried out by The Coull String Quartet.

It's in two long movements, each just under 16 minutes.

The first movement starts out quietly and slowly and ends that way following a typical Simpson fugue and climax.

The second movement is 16 minutes of drive, momentum and dancing scherzo energy. The Hyperion website describes it as

" ......perhaps the longest scherzo for string quartet in existence. This ferociously energetic movement is still dominated by minor thirds and fourths; like the central part of Simpson's Ninth Symphony it adopts Beethoven's characteristic one-in-a-bar triple-time pulses, astonishingly maintaining the pace for nearly 1800 bars, though it is not, as the composer says 'all just sound and fury''.

There is also the obvious comparison with Simpson's 11th Symphony, which has similar architecture - architecture? Xenakis and Simpson similarly fastidiously focused on such thorough composing? I've heard that said - who'd think a Simpson/Xenakis connection?

I've always had this quartet up there with his best and indeed would recommend it as one of a few good ways into his music. But on repeated listens (5 times so far today) I'm wondering if it's one of his very, very best.

This marvelous CD comes with the excellent String Quintet.

[Richard Barrett]

I note that the name of the guest violist on the Quintet could easily be the answer President Trump would give to the question "what do you do at the weekends when it's not golfing weather?" (I'll get my coat.)

I might have a go at some of Simpson's chamber music instead. Partly because some moments of that 9th Symphony seem despite everything to have lodged themselves in my memory.

[Beef Oven!]

I note that the name of the guest violist on the Quintet could easily be the answer President Trump would give to the question "what do you do at the weekends when it's not golfing weather?" (I'll get my coat.)

I might have a go at some of Simpson's chamber music instead. Partly because some moments of that 9th Symphony seem despite everything to have lodged themselves in my memory.

Nearly didn't post the back cover of that CD - so glad I did

(I bet the final bars of that symphony would have lodged themselves in your memory, too )

[LeMartinPecheur]

No, you have completely missed the point. Whether you care for Simpson's music doesn't matter to me at all. What I'm 'not interested in' is posts that seek to feed off others in the group to confirm their prejudices.

How dare you judge what my post sought to do. If you think you understand my mind and intention you are completely wrong. And my opinion is a prejudice is it? How, as a matter of taste based on experience, is it different in kind from yours?