New Sub-Forum: Composers

I cannot but help remember Simpson for his observation years ago about the business of HIPP performance to the extent that, as he evidently saw it, one cannot listen to Bach today as Bach's contemporaries would have done because we have listened to Xenakis - the only reference to Xenakis that I ever recall hearing Robert Simpson make...

**ferneyhoughgeliebte** · 18-02-17, 22:00

Originally posted by ahinton View Post

I cannot but help remember Simpson for his observation years ago about the business of HIPP performance to the extent that, as he evidently saw it, one cannot listen to Bach today as Bach's contemporaries would have done because we have listened to Xenakis - the only reference to Xenakis that I ever recall hearing Robert Simpson make...

I remember you mentioning this before - not one of Simpson's better comments, is it? We cannot see Titian as Titian's contemporaries would have done, because we've seen Francis Bacon - that's still no reason to go over Titian's work with acrylic paint; we cannot watch Shakespeare as Shakespeare's contemporaries would have done, because we've seen Beckett - that's no reason to have the scripts re-written in "modern" language. Where he got the idea that the purpose of HIPP was to listen to the Music as the contemporaries would have done I think it charitable not to speculate!

**Lat-Literal** · 18-02-17, 22:13

Originally posted by ahinton View Post

I cannot but help remember Simpson for his observation years ago about the business of HIPP performance to the extent that, as he evidently saw it, one cannot listen to Bach today as Bach's contemporaries would have done because we have listened to Xenakis - the only reference to Xenakis that I ever recall hearing Robert Simpson make...

Originally posted by ferneyhoughgeliebte View Post

I remember you mentioning this before - not one of Simpson's better comments, is it? We cannot see Titian as Titian's contemporaries would have done, because we've seen Francis Bacon - that's still no reason to go over Titian's work with acrylic paint; we cannot watch Shakespeare as Shakespeare's contemporaries would have done, because we've seen Beckett - that's no reason to have the scripts re-written in "modern" language. Where he got the idea that the purpose of HIPP was to listen to the Music as the contemporaries would have done I think it charitable not to speculate!

I will leave that one to the experts.

A few more suggestions added in a post above (79) for amending slightly if wishing to include.

Plus G and S - http://www.for3.org/forums/showthread.php?13641-G-amp-S

**Lat-Literal** · 18-02-17, 22:27

**Lat-Literal** · 19-02-17, 01:02

**ferneyhoughgeliebte** · 19-02-17, 10:00

Many thanks, Lats - I shall sort these out during the course of what I hope will be a lazy day.

**Richard Barrett** · 19-02-17, 10:25

Originally posted by ferneyhoughgeliebte View Post

not one of Simpson's better comments, is it?

I certainly hope not. One of the weird things about it is that Simpson's music itself seems completely unaffected by any acquaintance he might have had with Xenakis - an anachronist calling the kettle anachronistic, so to speak.

There are probably a few interesting composer threads lurking on the H&N board also.

**Dave2002** · 19-02-17, 10:55

Originally posted by ferneyhoughgeliebte View Post

mmmmmmmmmmmmm

Doesn't seem to work away from the buzzing metropolis of the iPad, so for those of us out in the cyber sticks:

Make sure the Number Lock is switched on on the number keypad (NOT the numbers above the "QWERTY ... " letters, nor the function keys above that, but the number pad on the right of the keyboard).

Go to (or, better still, print out the details from this site):

Special Characters — Alt Keyboard Sequences

https://tools.oratory.com/altcodes.html

Special Characters Alt Keyboard Sequences

Hold down the Alt key and type out the number of the accented letter you want.

And Lo!

So - you want "Götterdämmerung" instead of "Gotterdammerung"?
Type the "G" as normal,
make sure the number lock is ON,
hold down the "Alt" key and type out the number 148,
then let go of the Alt key - and the ö will appear where it should be.
type out "tterd" (no sniggering you boys at the back!)
hold down the Alt key and type out the number 132
let go of the Alt key and ä will appear.
type out "mmerung".

And so on for all the different accents available. (Some aren't - the bar through the second L in "Lutoslawski" for one

)

Another way, which works on most machines is to use Copy and Paste - first locate some text containing the character or word you want to put in. Using a search usually finds some suitable text. For example, try 'Zdenek Fibich'. This should show some text with an upside down 'circumflex' on the screen over the second 'e'.

Copy it - doesn't usually matter what size it is, and then insert it into the input panel. This method usually works. You can put the words or characters into a file for reuse if you wish. This works on names such as Antonín Dvořák (unusual mark over the 'i' and also the 'r') and Béla Bartók (unusual accent over the 'o').

However, as mentioned Lutoslawski/Lutosławski is hard, and this method doesn't work - or at least I've not managed to get it to do so.

On Macs the solution is to change the language setting to Polish, then look for the keyboard viewer, and the symbol 'ł' will appear to the right of the standard 'l'. I usually have an icon in the menu bar to show which language the keyboard is currently set to. To do this, go to System Preferences, then select Keyboard. Then choose the Input Sources tab, and add in language options by using the + which will appear in a panel at the left. Finally check the box marked "Show input menu in menu bar". This puts an icon with a flag in the menu bar at the top, and if selected a drop down menu appears. From there another option is to show the keyboard viewer, if you don't know which key is assigned to each symbol. There should also be a character viewer, which for some reason I can't see at present on this machine running El Capitan.

On iPads there are often multiple options which can be selected by keeping one's finger pressed over the 'base' key, and then just select the accented one you want, though I don't know if very unusual marks are catered for. Maybe they work if different language settings are put in.

**Lat-Literal** · 20-02-17, 00:26

Ferney - thank you for including most of 83 and 84.

Could I just gently mention post 79 again? I don't know if you have had an opportunity to consider it?

Also, a trifle - could we have VW in capital letters at a convenient time?

He was, after all, a vehicle for the people. Thank you.

**Beef Oven!** · 20-02-17, 00:29

Originally posted by Lat-Literal View Post

Ferney - thank you for including most of 83 and 84. Could I just gently mention post 79 again? I don't know if you have had an opportunity to consider it? Also, a trifle - could we have VW in capital letters at a convenient time as he was a people's machine?

Lat, maybe we should ease up a bit now, and add composers when we’ve got something to say about them. I’m sure we’ll get them all covered in the end! Just a suggestion.

**Lat-Literal** · 20-02-17, 00:34

Originally posted by Beef Oven! View Post

Lat, maybe we should ease up a bit now, and add composers when we’ve got something to say about them. I’m sure we’ll get them all covered in the end! Just a suggestion.

Yes but these are existing posts based on the considerable work I did yesterday. They are currently hanging in the air - much as was the original post on Copland where the correct original link was first shown. It was your idea. We are doing the work for you. I'm not sure I am going to accept a unique set of arbitrary conditions unless the regime has changed or perhaps merely been trumped. Actually, it would be a reasonable response for someone to say why the ones that haven't been included haven't been included. I don't object to it as long as there is the courtesy of feedback. Do you have a view? Otherwise it could look a little like a grasping from some self-appointed highs. Incidentally, the approach isn't arbitrary. It has been, among other things, to get the main composers in so it doesn't look silly, to make it wide-ranging so it is interesting, surprising in places and not exclusive to one music group on the forum, to get something in for most of the letters and to make sure it isn't wholly white and male. I expect none of these would have applied without it.

New Sub-Forum: Composers

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