Elgar 29 Jul - 2 Aug

[Serial_Apologist]

Hi, S-A, you might be interested in JPE Harper Scott's book 'Elgar, a modernist composer' (Cambridge 2010). I haven't read it, though I was most interested to read your posts above .

On could, of course, say 'it depends what you mean by 'modernism'. Parry was acclaimed as a 'modernist ' in the 1880s when his Prometheus Unbound was first performed, and while Elgar's musical language didn't keep pace with the rapid advances of Schoenberg and Stravinsky in the early 20th century, there are passages in the two big oratorios, the secoind symphony and Falstaff which would have sounded very modern to their first audiences .

Thanks smittins - I'll definitely look into Mr Scott's book.

[silvestrione]

Thanks to S-A for his thoughtful, knowledgeable extended posts. Helpful for me as recently I have made a bit more headway than before with AS and Berg (have always liked Webern).

Not sure I've ever listened to Elgar's Violin Sonata. Must try it.

I'm another admirer (well, I love!) Rubbra Sym 5, 6 and 7.

[smittims]

For me the classic version of the Elgar sonata is Sammons/Murdoch on Naxos or Dutton, but Sammons' pupil Hugh Bean made a fine stereo version for EMI with David Parkhouse.

[LMcD]

For me the classic version of the Elgar sonata is Sammons/Murdoch on Naxos or Dutton, but Sammons' pupil Hugh Bean made a fine stereo version for EMI with David Parkhouse.

The Nash Ensemble's version on Helios is coupled with the sublime Piano Quintet.

[hmvman]

I was a bit disappointed that we only got one movement of the violin sonata but all of the 'cello concerto. A nod to populism, I suspect.

[smittims]

This is one of the faults of this programme for me. That sonata does need hearing entire to make its effect, not least because there are thematic links from one movement to another.

I think COTW needs replacing with a similar strand which allows only complete works. This of course would explode the one -hour fixed format, as (for instance) a programme in a series on Wagner would need longer episodes that a Webern series. I'd like to see more emphasis (in the spoken bits) on the music than on. for example, how many children the composer's wife was having, etc.

[Sir Velo]

I think COTW needs replacing with a similar strand which allows only complete works. This of course would explode the one -hour fixed format, as (for instance) a programme in a series on Wagner would need longer episodes that a Webern series. I'd like to see more emphasis (in the spoken bits) on the music than on. for example, how many children the composer's wife was having, etc.

There has to be a balance between the biographical and the musicological but I would say that the programme has erred recently far too much in the direction of the former.

[Serial_Apologist]

Looking through a list of Elgar's living addresses, I discovered his first London address to have been here in Crystal Palace in 1889, when they had married. I could find no physical trace of The Oaks, on Fountain Drive. Then yesterday it occurred to me that it might be on one of my old maps, and there it was, actually marked on the 1871 OS Kent Sheet 7.10 centreing on the Palace, where Elgar had some gigs I believe - his main reason for their moving this way. The exact location of the house - sandwiched in the tight angle where Fountain Drive forks away south from College Road, so it must have been small - now has two houses from the 1950s on it. I slightly know the man living there - my upstairs neighbour does his accounts. It is a mere two minutes' stroll from where I live!

[smittims]

I've read that they could hear the organ pedal notes from the Palace. Goodness knows what an orchestra sounded like in that space.

If only Elgar had hit success in that first London period his career might have been very different.

[Nick Armstrong]

There has to be a balance between the biographical and the musicological but I would say that the programme has erred recently far too much in the direction of the former.

Just catching up with the “Self-Made Man” episode, and had to relisten to one thing to make sure I hadn’t mis-heard… but no, a rare lapse: DM referred to Elgar’s disappointment at not being in the Coronation Honours List in June 1902 for the “new king, George V”……

[smittims]

He also referred to Dora Penney as Dora Powell, which she wasn't at the time Elgar knew her in Malvern. I hear lots of little slips like these, which is one reason I've stopped listening.

[Serial_Apologist]

He also referred to Dora Penney as Dora Powell, which she wasn't at the time Elgar knew her in Malvern. I hear lots of little slips like these, which is one reason I've stopped listening.

Lack of time allowing for checking and proof-reading, I wonder?

[Sir Velo]

Just catching up with the “Self-Made Man” episode, and had to relisten to one thing to make sure I hadn’t mis-heard… but no, a rare lapse: DM referred to Elgar’s disappointment at not being in the Coronation Honours List in June 1902 for the “new king, George V”……

That is a bad error and suggestive that the interns have been let loose again without appropriate supervision or review of their "output". However, DM and/or the producer should have sufficient general knowledge to be able to rectify on the fly.

[Serial_Apologist]

That is a bad error and suggestive that the interns have been let loose again without appropriate supervision or review of their "output". However, DM and/or the producer should have sufficient general knowledge to be able to rectify on the fly.

And put right, as an old work colleague would say whenever anyone used this word!