Alexander Scriabin: 27 April – 1 May

[doversoul1]

It can be an interesting lead (contextualisation?) to this week’s BaL.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b05s3dhv

[ardcarp]

An interesting figure. I only got to hear his Piano Concerto today in the final part of CotW and have to say I wouldn't worry if I didn't hear it again! But I must listen to some more.

[Serial_Apologist]

Like Szymanowsky, Scriabin was influenced by Chopin early on. Next he fell under the spell of "Tristan", and I reckon he was then influenced by Debussy, orchestration-wise and harmonically, though I could be wrong there. But, stick with it because he gets more interesting as the week progresses, ardy.

[ardcarp]

Thanks. I will. I tripped over him as an undergrad, but have sadly forgotten almost everything except that he became something of a mystic.

[Pianorak]

For Scriabin fans: Radio 3 19:30

Wigmore Hall: Garrick Ohlsson performs Scriabin
Radio 3 Live in Concert

Presented by Martin Handley

Skryabin: 24 Preludes Op. 1: No. 15 Prelude in D flat major
Piano Sonata No. 1 in F Minor Op. 6
2 Pieces Op. 59: II. Prélude
Piano sonata No. 8 in A minor Op. 66
Piano Sonata No. 9 in F major Op. 68 'Black Mass'

8.15: Interval

Piano Sonata No. 3 in F sharp minor Op. 23 'Etats d'âme'
Piano Sonata No. 10 in C major Op. 70 'Trill'

[LeMartinPecheur]

Thanks. I will. I tripped over him as an undergrad, but have sadly forgotten almost everything except that he became something of a mystic.

Something of a mystic?? If so I wouldn't much want to meet someone who was into it 100%

[ardcarp]

I heard the whole Wigmore recital this pm, so thanks Pianorak. The Black Mass was...how shall I put it? The inside Scriabin's head couldn't have been a comfortable place as he wrote it. Will try to keep up with CotW.

[ardcarp]

Well Scriabin's 'journey' as laid out by CotW was indeed worth sticking with, so thanks, SA. In many ways it was more remarkable than, say, Schoenberg's.

[Serial_Apologist]

Well Scriabin's 'journey' as laid out by CotW was indeed worth sticking with, so thanks, SA. In many ways it was more remarkable than, say, Schoenberg's.

In many ways the journey narrowed harmonically, making it easier to follow than Schoenberg's, which broadened over the same era, as well as easier to identify, though more recent commentators have remarked on this narrowing to the specific spectrum of enharmonic devices including the so-called "mysic chord" (everywhere heard in jazz these days!) as precursing dodecaphonic procedures.

There was no mention of Debussy influence, though to me it was strongly present in the whole-tone harmonies increasingly to the fore after 1904, and the opulent orchestration in the Poem of Ecstasy, with its melodic use of the trumpet and harp cascadings - so different from the Wagnerian textures of the Divine Poem of only 5 years earlier - more than suggesting Scriabin would have come across Debussy, or at least French impressionist orchestral works such as Ravel's Sheherezade, while on his European sojourn around that time. I wonder if I am alone in hearing a reverse influence of the Poem of Ecstasy in large parts of Stravinsky's Firebird, notwithstanding the latter's proclaimed dislike of Scriabin - and of both works in Debussy's Jeux. Mention was made of Rachmaninov among the pallbearers at Scriabin's funeral, but hardly any of other composers' reactions to his music, apart from Rimsky's and Liadov's. It would have been instructive to have heard more; but one supposes there is only so much time to include as many facets of a composer as can be contained in 5 hour's illustrated commentary.

[ardcarp]

I'm looking forward to BAL tomorrow...Scriabin's Prometheus (Poem of Fire). I've no idea what to expect, but the discography seems fairly small, so the reviewer should be able to deal with it in some detail.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

. I wonder if I am alone in hearing a reverse influence of the Poem of Ecstasy in large parts of Stravinsky's Firebird, notwithstanding the latter's proclaimed dislike of Scriabin - and of both works in Debussy's Jeux

By "reverse influence", do you mean "Stravinsky's Firebird influenced Scriabin's Poem of Ecstasy", S_A? But the Scriabin was written two years before the Stravinsky. Scriabin's Prometheus was premiered after the Firebird, but Scriabin had been working on it since 1909, and had played parts of it at a party in Koussevitsky's house. It's more likely that young Stravinsky was (however obliquely we use the term) influenced by Scriabin, isn't it? Or that they both developed their Musical "sound" from Rimsky-Korsakoff's use of octotonic harmony in his later works - and/or from Mussorgsky's use of the same harmonic source, which Debussy also encountered when with Mdme von Meck?

[Serial_Apologist]

By "reverse influence", do you mean "Stravinsky's Firebird influenced Scriabin's Poem of Ecstasy", S_A? But the Scriabin was written two years before the Stravinsky. Scriabin's Prometheus was premiered after the Firebird, but Scriabin had been working on it since 1909, and had played parts of it at a party in Koussevitsky's house. It's more likely that young Stravinsky was (however obliquely we use the term) influenced by Scriabin, isn't it? Or that they both developed their Musical "sound" from Rimsky-Korsakoff's use of octotonic harmony in his later works - and/or from Mussorgsky's use of the same harmonic source, which Debussy also encountered when with Mdme von Meck?

That figures. Actually I was thinking the other way around, ferney - namely of the possible influence of Poem of Ecstasy on Firebird.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

That figures. Actually I was thinking the other way around, ferney - namely of the possible influence of Poem of Ecstasy on Firebird.

Oh, I agree with that - the Dance of the Firebird is pure Alexander Nicolaevich:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9OuxgP19ak

[Bryn]

Let's not forget Zvezdoliki. It's easy to overlook the influence of Scriabin on the work due to its famed dedication to Debussy. However, as Stravinsky mentioned in a post card to Florent Schmitt, at the time of its composition he was playing the music of both Debussy and Scriabin exclusively.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Let's not forget Zvezdoliki. It's easy to overlook the influence of Scriabin on the work due to its famed dedication to Debussy. However, as Stravinsky mentioned in a post card to Florent Schmitt, at the time of its composition he was playing the music of both Debussy and Scriabin exclusively.