Musical questions and answers thread

[EdgeleyRob]

Thanks for those suggestions vinteuil,duly ordered the Stravinsky and vol 1 of the Bartok.
Yes the Bach C Major prelude is my party piece,well only piece that I can get through without a duff note.
I am enjoying having a go by myself at the moment

[cloughie]

Thanks for those suggestions vinteuil,duly ordered the Stravinsky and vol 1 of the Bartok.
Yes the Bach C Major prelude is my party piece,well only piece that I can get through without a duff note.
I am enjoying having a go by myself at the moment

If you're starting from scratch I recommend 'Adult All-in-One Course: Lesson, Theory, Technique Level 1 (Alfred's Basic Adult Piano Course)'. Available from the River People but have a look at it in your local music store. Unless you're an absolute natural be patient and don't expect to be be playing all those pieces you love any time soon. Learning correct fingering, starting pieces with hands separately then putting them together, counting amd getting note lengths correct and pedaling all take time and perseverance. Lessons are a good idea if you can get a good teacher, but come at a cost, and you need to give yourself plenty of practice time. Enjoy.

Eighteen Little Preludes BWV 924-8, 930, 933-43 & 999 (Easier Piano Pieces) are worth looking at.

[MrGongGong]

Is Czerny's 'Practical Method For Beginners On The Pianoforte Op.599' worth buying,or is it outdated ?
If not what would piano playing forumites suggest as an alternative for a beginner like myself ?
Clementi scales and exercises maybe ?

Kurtag all the way IMV

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Játékok

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Given your fondness for 20th Century Soviet Music, Edgey, you might find this right up your street:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Easy-Pieces-Schirmers-Library-Classics/dp/0793589304

Czerny was used by many virtuoso pianists, I don't think you'd regret using the pieces and exercises for building up finger muscle memory - but Bartok, Kurtag etc are very useful for later repertoire. And, of course, with time:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Anna-Magdalena-Bach-Signature-ABRSM/dp/1854729519

[EdgeleyRob]

If you're starting from scratch I recommend 'Adult All-in-One Course: Lesson, Theory, Technique Level 1 (Alfred's Basic Adult Piano Course)'. Available from the River People but have a look at it in your local music store. Unless you're an absolute natural be patient and don't expect to be be playing all those pieces you love any time soon. Learning correct fingering, starting pieces with hands separately then putting them together, counting amd getting note lengths correct and pedaling all take time and perseverance. Lessons are a good idea if you can get a good teacher, but come at a cost, and you need to give yourself plenty of practice time. Enjoy.

Eighteen Little Preludes BWV 924-8, 930, 933-43 & 999 (Easier Piano Pieces) are worth looking at.

Thanks cloughie,I've ordered the Bach and will try to look at the All in one course at some point.
Yes I'm ok playing with hands separately,it goes pear shaped when I play them together,not even used the pedals yet !!!

[EdgeleyRob]

Kurtag all the way IMV

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Játékok

Thanks GG,looks a bit scary to me though.

[EdgeleyRob]

Given your fondness for 20th Century Soviet Music, Edgey, you might find this right up your street:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Easy-Pieces-Schirmers-Library-Classics/dp/0793589304

Czerny was used by many virtuoso pianists, I don't think you'd regret using the pieces and exercises for building up finger muscle memory - but Bartok, Kurtag etc are very useful for later repertoire. And, of course, with time:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Anna-Magdal.../dp/1854729519

Thanks ferney,I never even considered Kabalevsky,duly ordered it and the JSB

[teamsaint]

Rit or Rall ?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Rit or Rall ?

When?

Strictly speaking "Rit" used to mean a sudden slowing down to emphasize a phrase/passage, and "Rall" meant a gradual slowing down, often to a new section in a slower tempo. Nowadays, composers and other Musicians use both terms interchangeably.

[teamsaint]

When?

Strictly speaking "Rit" used to mean a sudden slowing down to emphasize a phrase/passage, and "Rall" meant a gradual slowing down, often to a new section in a slower tempo. Nowadays, composers and other Musicians use both terms interchangeably.

Yup, I was just wondering if people had a preference,(EG composers ) or a strong feeling about when each might be used,although as you say, they seem to be pretty much interchangeable.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

When?

Strictly speaking "Rit" used to mean a sudden slowing down to emphasize a phrase/passage, and "Rall" meant a gradual slowing down, often to a new section in a slower tempo. Nowadays, composers and other Musicians use both terms interchangeably.

Ritardando and Rallentando both suggest a gradual slowing down.
Ritenuto means a more sudden reduction in tempo.

The problem is that "rit" is a vague abbreviation.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Ritardando and Rallentando both suggest a gradual slowing down.
Ritenuto means a more sudden reduction in tempo.

The problem is that "rit" is a vague abbreviation.

(or, at least, "ambiguous".)

[Pabmusic]

Hello all. Here's my take on rit., rall., etc.

We easily slip into a mode of thinking these terms are used objectively. Ferney is absolutely right about the difference betwee rit. and rall.;EA was right to point out there are two rits. But that sort of misses the point that they're hardly objective terms to start with, but rather crude ways to convey the composer's complex thoughts. What one composer means by rit. may differ from what another means. There's a raft of terms that can all mean something similar - rit., rall, ritard., ten., allarg.,large., and more. Part of the performer's job is surely to interpret their meanings. In particular - when the same composer uses different terms in the same work, what does the difference mean? What is the justification? This is where - say - Ferney's definitions are the places to start; but not necessarily to end.

And some composers are just sloppy anyway. :)

[Pulcinella]

The two scales used in Stravinsky's Concertino (in tonight's concert) were, apparently, incorrectly described as C and C sharp major by Vlad, in his book on Stravinsky.
White spotted the error, and describes the scales as C major and B major.
The later edition of Vlad that I have acknowledges the error, but then says:
It does not seem to me vitally important to decide whether the second scale is effectively B major or C sharp in the phrygian mode. I incline myself towards the latter interpretation.

Could someone enlighten me?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Could someone enlighten me?

Not me.

The "Phrygian Mode", used in this context, is the sound created by using the white notes of the keyboard starting on E and going up an octave:

E F G A B C D E

... the intervals between those pitches being S T T T S T T ("S" = "semitone", "T" = "whole tone")

The Phrygian Scale starting on C# (which is what I think Vlad means by "C# in the Phrygian Mode") would go:

C# D E F# G# A B C#

... and if you shunt these pitches back one (so that it starts on B, instead of C#) you get

B C# D E F# G A B

... which isn't B major ("effectively" or otherwise).

Unless Vlad means something very different when he says "C sharp in the phrygian mode" from what I understand, he's blustering.


(And, whilst I don't know the work very well, I suspect that both Vlad and White are probably missing Igor's characteristic use of the Octotonic scale anyway!)