Books about music

[LeMartinPecheur]

Having emoticoned that, it might be termed "criticism" if it were based on demonstrable fact(s) rather than superficial opinion. "Simply lacking" "emotional impact and a significant content"? Pah! It is Mr Morris who is "simply lacking" here.

Emoticon duly noted fhg! But I'm still surprised at your statement emboldened(?) above.

There never are 'demonstrable facts' that prove personal likes and dislikes, no matter how widely they are held. De gustibus non est disputandum, not because we can't dispute (we always can, and often do) but because nobody ever wins the argument definitively There is never a complete, unanswerable, logical refutation of the view proposed that will make it impossible for anyone sensible to hold.

Even if you persuade me to believe Simpson expresses something important (and I don't say you couldn't: I do keep trying with him, not least because so many people I respect do get something valuable from him), this still doesn't stop someone else holding my former view. Indeed, perhaps the most basic fact about Simpson, and indeed about classical music in toto, is that the great majority doesn't care a stuff for it! Ergo it's all rubbish of course...

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

There never are 'demonstrable facts' that prove personal likes and dislikes, no matter how widely they are held.

Well, no - but, I think uniquely of the books listed here, Morris is the only one who has written negatively of a composer. All the others express positive comments on the Music they discuss, pointing out factual matters of structure, rhythm, harmony, history, instrumentation, reception history etc etc. This is what makes them valuable (for me at any rate).

Journalistic reviews of Music the reviewer has disliked might give us insight into the reviewer, but are of little value in connecting the reader to the Music. Morris might have comments wittier and less pompous-sounding (to Simpson's admirers) than that expressed in the comment you quote, but it focusses on Morris, not the Music. And I'm not interested in Morris.

[Mattbod]

Sorry I meant Percy Scholes! I have both his last version of the Oxford Companion (bought at Oxfam for fiver but the modern Catherine Latham edition is also excellent and good value for money. I just don't think it is as full and lacks the writing flare of Scholes.

On more more specialised footing I would recommend the recent Bach: Music in the Castle of Heaven by John Eliot Gardiner. It has its flaws in that it is the book that Gardiner wanted to write. What I mean is that is is very biased towards his expertise: choral music and there is scant regard to Bach the organist and keyboard player or his music for keyboard and organ. For a complete sweep you will have to see Wolff but the book is an engaging read and was obviously a labour of love for Gardiner. Another good book on Bach is The New Bach Reader published by Norton which has translations of most of Bach's surviving correspondence.

[EdgeleyRob]

Oxford companion to music.
Plenty of those BBC music guides.
Loads of RVW books (Kennedy,Ursula VW etc etc).
The Michael Kennedy portraits of Elgar and Walton.
C Hubert H Parry,His Life and Music by Jeremy Dibble.
Britten,Carpenter.
Karajan,Osborne.

If anyone can recommed a decent book on Stanford I'd be very grateful.

[LeMartinPecheur]

Well, no - but, I think uniquely of the books listed here, Morris is the only one who has written negatively of a composer. All the others express positive comments on the Music they discuss, pointing out factual matters of structure, rhythm, harmony, history, instrumentation, reception history etc etc. This is what makes them valuable (for me at any rate).

Journalistic reviews of Music the reviewer has disliked might give us insight into the reviewer, but are of little value in connecting the reader to the Music. Morris might have comments wittier and less pompous-sounding (to Simpson's admirers) than that expressed in the comment you quote, but it focusses on Morris, not the Music. And I'm not interested in Morris.

Well I kinda see what you mean fhg, but Morris - as I tried to point out in saying that the 'Dictionary' in the title might mislead - has clearly set out not just to list but to evaluate just about all C20 music from right across the world.

It's perhaps unfortunate that I picked on his treatment of Simpson but a) critics aren't very useful or credible if they just say every composer's 'very good', especially when they are attempting comprehensive coverage of the world scene; b) he doesn't go out of his way to knock composers and generally encourages readers to explore the unknown; c) I wanted to give a small flavour of his style, and thought - perhaps mistakenly - that this was best done by quoting a negative write-up, if only to demonstrate that he does have personal views clearly expressed, not just the same bland endorsement for everyone.

Probably nuff said now?

[Roehre]

Mrs R is always -not completely without a reason - complaining about the size of my music library:

without the scores, a selection:
Groves (Sadie's 1980 edition)
MGG1
MGG2-sachteil
MGG2-personenteil
A large cross-section of the BBC-music guides

many biographies, most of them the "standard culprits" like de la Grange/ Mitchell/ Blaukopf [Mahler], Moldenhauer [Webern], Carpenter [Brittten], Robbins Landon [Haydn & Mozart], Zaslaw [Mozart], Thayer-Forbes [Beethoven], Kennedy [RVW, Walton], Seabrook [PMD], Noske [Sweelinck]...

some 250 vols re Beethoven (note: that's twice the number Beethoven-specialist Suchet claims), including the latest Brief-edition, the Konversationshefte, the sketchbooks (as far as published), the 6 vol Beethoven Handbuch, the Beethoven Jahrbuch (10 vols 1950-1983), Bonner Beethoven Studien sofar 10 vols (1999-....) etc

Mozart Handbuch (6 vols)
JSBach Handbuch (6 vols)
Stockhausen über Stockhausen (exact title? 6 vols, 1955-1995)

The women composers Encyclopaedia (2 vols, some 1000-odd entries)

Many books on 20C music and composers (published between 1920 and 2010), including The Pimlico Dictionary of 20th Century Composers mentioned before and Dibelius Musik 1945-1965 and Musik 1965-1985

A for me indispensible book is
Jerzy Chwialkowski: The DaCapo Catalog of Classical Music Compositions

[mercia]

some impressive tomes being listed <genuflect emoticon>

what is MGG please ?

[Roehre]

some impressive tomes being listed <genuflect emoticon>

what is MGG please ?

MGG = Musik in Geschichte und Gegenwart (Music Past and Present), a German multivolume handbook, first edition 1950-1975 [22 vols], 2nd edition (=MGG2) 1997-2010
MGG2-Personenteil consists exclusively of musicians' biographies and composers' worklists and assessments [18 vols],
MGG2-Sachteil of all other topics related with (mainly, but not exclusively) classical music [11 vols]

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Well I kinda see what you mean fhg, but Morris - as I tried to point out in saying that the 'Dictionary' in the title might mislead - has clearly set out not just to list but to evaluate just about all C20 music from right across the world.

It's perhaps unfortunate that I picked on his treatment of Simpson but a) critics aren't very useful or credible if they just say every composer's 'very good', especially when they are attempting comprehensive coverage of the world scene; b) he doesn't go out of his way to knock composers and generally encourages readers to explore the unknown; c) I wanted to give a small flavour of his style, and thought - perhaps mistakenly - that this was best done by quoting a negative write-up, if only to demonstrate that he does have personal views clearly expressed, not just the same bland endorsement for everyone.

Probably nuff said now?

Fairy Nuff

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

A for me indispensible book is
Jerzy Chwialkowski: The DaCapo Catalog of Classical Music Compositions

Sounds like one of those books that, once you've finished reading it, you just have to go back to beginning and start it all over again.

[mercia]

thanks roehre

[Roehre]

Sounds like one of those books that, once you've finished reading it, you just have to go back to beginning and start it all over again.

It isn't, as it literally is a catalogue of the works of 132 major composers (between Monteverdi and Stockhausen) and therefore a very handy reference work and -on top of that- very reliable too. Though it only gives the titles of the works, with opus number, other catalogue numbers, year of composition and/or first performance [if known], and -if e.g. Lieder cycle or opera- the Lied or "aria" titles [even in Wagner, hence "arias" between quotes] but no incipits or other musical examples..

[Thropplenoggin]

Am I the only one given to riffling through Rameau's Treatise on Harmony and Johannes Kepler's Harmonices Mundi of an evening?

[Roehre]

...or Berlioz/Strauss', Rimsky Korssakov's or Piston's Treatises on orchestration

[vinteuil]

Am I the only one given to riffling through Rameau's Treatise on Harmony and Johannes Kepler's Harmonices Mundi of an evening?

... well, some of us are still far too engrossed in Marin Mersenne's Harmonie Universelle, Thomas Morley's Plaine and Easie Introduction to Practicall Musicke, and CPE Bach's Versuch über die wahre Art das Clavier zu Spielen....