How do you convert a Mozart sceptic?

[salymap]

I don't think there's any point in trying to win people over, though it baffles me that anyone would need to be converted to Mozart. I have long pondered why some composers appeal and some don't, and come to no real conclusion.

Plenty of people are indifferent or even hostile to my favourite composer, Britten, and although I may go on about him a bit (!) I've never tried to convert anyone. I just accept that he isn't for everyone, although of course I think they're missing a lot, poor things.

I quite agree Mary. A few of my numerous cousins are deeply musical, the majority couldn't care less, although some have a few favourite pieces.

Just live and let live, and perhaps be glad that Britten/Mozart, etc mean so much to us.

[jean]

You can hear it here.

I've always been impervious to Mozart. The bits I like are mostly unserious and/or early - the Seraglio, indeed anything pretend-Turkish, and I have a special affection for Sancta Maria, mater Dei (which is early I think).

[salymap]

I've always loved and known the symphonies and piano concertos, but am still discovering some wonderful gems among the chamber music.
A year or two ago I found K452, a Quintet for keyboard and winds. It comforts me when I am 'down' and I love its quirky little passages, going from one instrument to another.

[Sir Velo]

I've long since given up bothering trying to proselytise non classical music lovers. Life's too short. If by the time they get to say 35, they've yet to make the discovery, then it's their loss as far as I'm concerned. If someone shows a genuine interest, then I will give a few pointers and leave it to them to take it further.

[Dave2002]

Talking of The Queen of the Night, as we were earlier, has everyone heard Florence Foster Jenkins singing 'Der Holle Rache'?

I thought I had given the YouTube link in my earlier post - followed by the comment "run for cover". You can also find performances by Diana Damrau, Dessay, Moser and others from YouTube - some are good - all are better than the lady you mentioned. I'm not sure which order they should be listened to (and/or watched) but FFJ might have some of you rolling on the floor, laughing.

[Flosshilde]

I don't think there's any point in trying to win people over, though it baffles me that anyone would need to be converted to Mozart. I have long pondered why some composers appeal and some don't, and come to no real conclusion.

Plenty of people are indifferent or even hostile to my favourite composer, Britten, and although I may go on about him a bit (!) I've never tried to convert anyone. I just accept that he isn't for everyone, although of course I think they're missing a lot, poor things.

What irritates me about the original post, & others like it, is the implicit belief that if someone doesn't like Mozart's music they are lacking in something - sense, taste, civilization, intelligence? - & need to be brought to their senses. The belief that if only they would listen to Mozart (or Shostakovitch, or Britten, or Havergal Brian, or ABBA) properly then the scales would fall from their eyes (or ears) & they would enter the promised land.

It's only music, for heaven's sake. As Mary (more or less) says, some people like some composers, others like different composers. Get over it.

(Of course, if it's Wagner ...)

[Thropplenoggin]

What irritates me about the original post, & others like it, is the implicit belief that if someone doesn't like Mozart's music they are lacking in something - sense, taste, civilization, intelligence? - & need to be brought to their senses. The belief that if only they would listen to Mozart (or Shostakovitch, or Britten, or Havergal Brian, or ABBA) properly then the scales would fall from their eyes (or ears) & they would enter the promised land.

It's only music, for heaven's sake. As Mary (more or less) says, some people like some composers, others like different composers. Get over it.

(Of course, if it's Wagner ...)

Once again, the Great Flosshilde condemns everything and offer nothing but bile. I refer to your typically hostile first post. As the OP was at pains to point out, he was merely trying to help his friend understand WHY Mozart is so loved and receives such lofty praise: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Talk:W...Amadeus_Mozart

It's posts such as this, which I find tantamount to trolling, that have put me off contributing further to these boards.

If you didn't like the thread, feel free not to contribute your usual invective. I'm quite certain it won't be missed.

[french frank]

What irritates me about the original post, & others like it, is the implicit belief that if someone doesn't like Mozart's music they are lacking in something - sense, taste, civilization, intelligence? - & need to be brought to their senses.

I agree with Throppers - I think that was a very unfair comment, especially given that the OP expressed 'empathy' for the view, and agreed that there were many pieces to which he felt (possibly mistakenly) that the criticism could be justly applied. He wondered whether others boarders felt there were works that might 'win his friend over': not a hint about 'sense, taste, civilization, intelligence'. You wrote those in, which seems an odd thing to get 'irritated' about ...

[richardfinegold]

"How do you convert a Mozart sceptic?" You don't bother. Life's too short to waste trying to convert someone with such abject taste!

Pity him, don't convert him. He will probably show more curiosity if you try that approach

[Dave2002]

Once again, the Great Flosshilde condemns everything and offer nothing but bile. I refer to your typically hostile first post. As the OP was at pains to point out, he was merely trying to help his friend understand WHY Mozart is so loved and receives such lofty praise: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Talk:W...Amadeus_Mozart

It's posts such as this, which I find tantamount to trolling, that have put me off contributing further to these boards.

If you didn't like the thread, feel free not to contribute your usual invective. I'm quite certain it won't be missed.

Throppers

This time I don't agree with you, nor ff on this occasion, but please don't go!

I don't like cricket much, but thank goodness nobody has tried hard to convert me to like it. I do like Mozart, but why should someone feel a strong need to make someone like his music? The OP was reasonable, and did in fact state that his friend appeared to like, or at least tolerate some of Mozart's music, so perhaps that would be a way forward, find out what pieces are known and/or liked and try to extend from there, but there's not much point in making a long mission in this. I didn't see flosshilde's intervention as being too OTT.

Heaven help anyone who tries to get me to like Harrison Birtwistle.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Steady, Tiger!

The OP asks for advice to help his friend enjoy Mozart. Many suggestions have been made using recordings in the 20th Century tradition (including my own youTube link to Previn) - Oliver, using his personal experience, is suggesting that, if AP's friend hasn't been convinced by performances/recordings in this tradition, then he may (as Oliver himself was) see the light from HIPP recordings.

Fair enough, but you, Ferney, are someone I think of as a balanced HIPP enthusiast with an appreciation of modern interpretations as well. Others are not always quite so balanced.

[Flosshilde]

Once again, the Great Flosshilde condemns everything and offer nothing but bile. I refer to your typically hostile first post. As the OP was at pains to point out, he was merely trying to help his friend understand WHY Mozart is so loved and receives such lofty praise: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Talk:W...Amadeus_Mozart

It's posts such as this, which I find tantamount to trolling, that have put me off contributing further to these boards.

If you didn't like the thread, feel free not to contribute your usual invective. I'm quite certain it won't be missed.

Cheers Thropps, thanks for the advice. I shall continue to contribute as I have always done - sometimes with knowledge (not as much as I would like), sometimes with wit (I hope), sometimes with advice & help, sometimes asking for advice & help, sometimes with puzzlement & bemusement, sometimes with bad grammar, sometimes with rather elegantly written phrases (well, I like to think so), and sometimes with passion. I think that's what most of us do? You're quite free to put me on 'ignore' if you wish.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

?

[Flosshilde]

not a hint about 'sense, taste, civilization, intelligence'. You wrote those in, which seems an odd thing to get 'irritated' about ...

Quite agree, & I don't get irritated by them. It's the assumption (implicit in questions such as that originally posed) that if X doesn't like something that Y thinks is wonderful then X is lacking that irritates me (mildly).

Anyway, I must go & finish cleaning the bathroom before I head off to my studio.

[verismissimo]

Fair enough, but you, Ferney, are someone I think of as a balanced HIPP enthusiast with an appreciation of modern interpretations as well. Others are not always quite so balanced.

Moi?