Neglected 20th Century French composers

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  • Serial_Apologist
    Full Member
    • Dec 2010
    • 37678

    Neglected 20th Century French composers

    I have a particular interest in French composers of what I consider a sadly neglected generation, in this country at least - namely those who might be said to belong between Les Six and their contemporaries, such as Ibert and Sauguet, and what one might term the post-Messiaen generation of Boulez, Barraque, Amy, Phillipot and Boucourechliev.

    Some of this neglect might possibly be down to a certain kind of "in-betweenness" that characterises their music and position, coming in as they do as many of the Les Six group were turning towards a Neo-Classical aesthetic, (when many of this group share a neo-Romantic outlook, with little in common with contemporaneous developments oustide France), and before the serialist "explosion" from the late 1940s on led by Boulez. It may be of significance that one composers from this age group whose music is broadcast here from time to time falls into a Neo-Classical category that has more in common with, eg, Sauguet, Ibert or Poulenc in the 1930s: Jean Francaix; I cannot, however, recall any of the music of Henri Barraud being broadcast or put on in concerts this side of The Channel.

    The eldest of the group recently had, iirc, two works broadcast on Radio 3 - Andre Jolivet, (1905-74) - quite an event for him! He studied under Albert Roussel and also Edgard Varese, an influence apparent in an early work, the "Mana Suite" for piano of 1933, said plausibly to have influenced Messiaen's piano writing in the following decade. Unfortunately only 3 of the movements are available, the second link apparently not working:

    André Jolivet: Mana: I. Beaujolais, II. L'Oiseaux (1'20), III. La Princesse de Bali (3'05). Bryan Wagorn, Piano. Recorded live, New York City


    One of the most remarkable Jolivet works from the following decade is the Concderto for Ondes Martenot and Orchestra of 1948 - contemporary with his friend Messiaen's Turangalila, though Jolivet uses the instrument in a more percussive manner in the extraordinary middle movement than generally does Messiaen;

    André Jolivet (1905-1974): Concerto per ondes Martenot e orchestra (1947).1. Allegro moderatoJeanne Loriod, ondes MartenotOrchestre Philharmonique de l'ORTF ...


    André Jolivet (1905-1974): Concerto per ondes Martenot e orchestra (1947).2. Allegro vivace3. Largo cantabileJeanne Loriod, ondes MartenotOrchestre Philharmo...


    Having had the 1960s Erato recording in my possession it is good to have the impression of over-thick scoring mitigated in the clear rendition on those two links: Jolivet does not altogether escape the oft-made charge, but I feel that, as with Villa-Lobos, to be a case of over-running aural imagination resulting in impractibility.
    Last edited by Serial_Apologist; 02-06-13, 19:12.
  • Serial_Apologist
    Full Member
    • Dec 2010
    • 37678

    #2
    Varese put his name behind La Spirale - the group of French composers formed in 1936 by Jolivet, Messiaen, Jean-Yves Daniel-Lesur (1908-2002) and Yves Baudrier (1906-88), aiming to rescue French music from the perceived anti-romantic cynicism of the followers of Cocteau and Satie and restore its "spiritual values".

    Daniel Lesur is perhaps only known for his choral works over here, such as "Cantique des Cantiques", qwhich deploy perhaps an over-sweet modal harmonic language, a kind of watered down Messiaen, but I found this little instumental curiosity of a ballet score, "le Bal du Destin":

    Jean-Yves Daniel-Lesur (1908-2002) (France) Le Bal du Destin, suite de ballet (1965)Dir : Georges Tzipine1- Court prélude -- Valse de Faustina (6.12)2- Momen...


    You will hardly find anything on the web about Baudrier, who devoted himself mostly to film music, but here is a little tone poem from 1939:

    Auteur : Yves Baudrier (1906-1988)Titre : Le Grand voilier pour orchestre, poème symphonique (1939)Interprètes : Manuel Rosenthal ; Orchestre National de l'O...


    To French people of mine and my parents' generation Baudrier's name is linked to the famous 1946 film about French Partisan actions in WW2, "La Bataille du Rail", of which the following very grainy excerpt is the first 7 minutes:

    video, sharing, camera phone, video phone, free, upload
    Last edited by Serial_Apologist; 02-06-13, 19:36.

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    • BBMmk2
      Late Member
      • Nov 2010
      • 20908

      #3
      I didnt see this threaqd, until, I wrote on the ?Duttileaux one! What about these compsoers? Their works and recordings(if any?)
      Don’t cry for me
      I go where music was born

      J S Bach 1685-1750

      Comment

      • Serial_Apologist
        Full Member
        • Dec 2010
        • 37678

        #4
        Two of Messiaen's early pupils fell heavily under the Master's stylistic influence before turning to 12-tone composition. Here is Jean-Luis Martinet's symphonic poem "Orphee" of 1944/5:

        Auteur : Jean-Louis Martinet (1912-2010)Titre : Orphée, triptyque symphonique (1944-45)Structure : 1. Orphée devant Eurydice (0:00) ;2. La Descente aux Enf...


        In the early 1950s, under the influence of Stalinist "Socialist Realism", Martinet part-reverted to his earlier style and wrote music in favour of the class struggle. I don't have "Greve de la Faim", but here is a work fairly characteristic of his later music, from 1953, in which some may hear in the first half pre-echoes of Polish composers such as Lutoslawsky, Bacevicz and Kilar; and in the second a re-hash (quite frankly) of the closing passage of Honegger's 3rd symphony:

        Auteur : Jean-Louis Martinet (1912-2010)Titre : Mouvement symphonique n° 1 (1953)Structure : 1. (0:00) ; 2. (07:42)Interprètes : Jean Martinon ; Orchestre Na...


        I'm pretty sure the above is taken from a live R3 broadcast from Paris which included a performance of Schmitt's "Tragedie de Salome"

        Also a Messiaen pupil who turned to serialism and then Socialist Realism was Maurice Le Roux - known to some on here as conductor of a 1956 recording of "Turangalila" (my favourite in fact). The only music link for Le Roux I can find is the complete 1956 film "Le Ballon Rouge" - much loved by the French, with its delightful score:

        Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.


        Finally, a pupil of Honegger, very influenced by him (as can clearly be heard - but the important thing is to know what to do with influences, rather than hide them, non?) and his biographist. Here is the first symphony of 1949:

        Auteur : Marcel Landowski (1915-1999)Titre : Symphonie n° 1 « Jean de la Peur » (1949)Structure : 1. Allegro moderato (0:00) ; 2. Allegro scherzando (09:24) ...


        It might be worth remarking that Landowski it was who scored the film music for "Gigi".

        I'll check these links for any mistypings I may have made.
        Last edited by Serial_Apologist; 02-06-13, 19:31.

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        • Serial_Apologist
          Full Member
          • Dec 2010
          • 37678

          #5
          Apologies for typo errors on the links - now all corrected!

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          • cloughie
            Full Member
            • Dec 2011
            • 22119

            #6
            S_A
            I would like to add Florent Schmitt to your list. Tragedie de Salome is a gem!

            Comment

            • french frank
              Administrator/Moderator
              • Feb 2007
              • 30283

              #7
              Leaving aside Albéric Magnard who, poor fellow, didn't see much of the 20th c, what about Charles Koechlin? This is his Vers la voûte étoilée.
              It isn't given us to know those rare moments when people are wide open and the lightest touch can wither or heal. A moment too late and we can never reach them any more in this world.

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              • Serial_Apologist
                Full Member
                • Dec 2010
                • 37678

                #8
                Originally posted by cloughie View Post
                S_A
                I would like to add Florent Schmitt to your list. Tragedie de Salome is a gem!
                Yes, and I mentioned the Schmitt en passant; but I was thinking in the main of composers between the Poulenc and Boulez generations, cloughie.

                Comment

                • vinteuil
                  Full Member
                  • Nov 2010
                  • 12815

                  #9
                  .

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                  • french frank
                    Administrator/Moderator
                    • Feb 2007
                    • 30283

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Serial_Apologist View Post
                    but I was thinking in the main of composers between the Poulenc and Boulez generations, cloughie.
                    Mmm, I misunderstood too - but the Koechlin is nice
                    It isn't given us to know those rare moments when people are wide open and the lightest touch can wither or heal. A moment too late and we can never reach them any more in this world.

                    Comment

                    • Thropplenoggin
                      Full Member
                      • Mar 2013
                      • 1587

                      #11
                      Originally posted by vinteuil View Post


                      Heavens to Betsy!

                      It loved to happen. -- Marcus Aurelius

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                      • Serial_Apologist
                        Full Member
                        • Dec 2010
                        • 37678

                        #12
                        Originally posted by vinteuil View Post
                        Most interesting, thanks, vints. I had heard of Betsy Jolas, but still have to hear any music by her.

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                        • ferneyhoughgeliebte
                          Gone fishin'
                          • Sep 2011
                          • 30163

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Serial_Apologist View Post
                          The eldest of the group recently had, iirc, two works broadcast on Radio 3 - Andre Jolivet, (1905-74) - quite an event for him! He studied under Albert Roussel and also Edgard Varese, an influence apparent in an early work, the "Mana Suite" for piano of 1933, said plausibly to have influenced Messiaen's piano writing in the following decade. Unfortunately only 3 of the movements are available, the second link apparently not working:

                          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxg3ATeetaw
                          The link worked fine for me, S_A:

                          Mana: IV. La Chèvre, V. La Vache (1'50), VI. Pégase (3'24) Bryan Wagorn, Piano. Recorded live, New York City


                          ... and the whole suite deserves to be heard!

                          Having heard Nic Hodges' marvellous recital of Barraqué's early (unpublished) Piano Music (before a stunning performance of the Sonata) I thought that these filled the gap between Messiaen and the Piano Sonatas of Boulez and Barraqué himself - now I see (and hear!) that there was another link in that chain. Exciting Music, controlled fury superbly performed. Many Thanks.
                          [FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]

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                          • Serial_Apologist
                            Full Member
                            • Dec 2010
                            • 37678

                            #14
                            Not at all, ferney!

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                            • Richard Barrett

                              #15
                              Recently I heard an orchestral work Formes by Jean-Pierre Guézec (1934-71) which I found highly fascinating, almost describable in terms of bridging the gap between Boulez and Xenakis. His oeuvre isn't very large since he died so young (Xenakis' Charisma and an early version of the horn solo movement of Messiaen's Des canyons aux étoiles were dedicated to his memory) but everything in it is a lot more than "promising".

                              But the French composer of that generation I have most interest in is Jean-Claude Eloy (b 1938), whose output centres on vast electroacoustic compositions informed by Buddhist concepts like the four-hour Gaku-no-michi ("The Ways of Music") of 1977-78, a work of enormous depth and imagination easily comparable with things like Stockhausen's Hymnen or Xenakis' La Légende d'Eer. His earlier instrumental works like the more Boulez-like Equivalences for chamber orchestra of 1963 are on a similar level of achievement if in a more conventional vein.

                              The Hill/Simeone biography of Messiaen (which is an ecellent book, highly recommended) makes clear the great extent to which Messiaen was influenced not just by Jolivet but also by much less well-known composers like Maurice Emmanuel, whose orchestral music is worth a listen or two.

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