The Rite of Spring at 100

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I've never been wholly convinced that the work is quite as ground-breaking as it is commonly thought to be, given that it was composed after most of Debussy's work, Ravel's Daphnis et Chloë, Strauss's Salome and Elektra, Schönberg's Funf Orchesterstücke, Mahler's Ninth and Tenth symphonies, Skryabin's Prometheus and the composer's own l'Oiseau de Feu, but that fact no more undermines my recognition of it as one of the most important works of its day than it does my appreciation of its constant core repertoire position ever since it première; Carter (who, I believe, attended its US première, is by no means the only composer to have declared that listening to it for the first time inspired him to be a composer himself.

It is of true that there are other works that are at least as "ground-breaking" as Le Sacre (and I would add Webern's opera 5 - 10 to your list - I wrote in awed tones about Debussy's achievement in Jeux only a fortnight ago, on the centenary of its premiere) and Stravinsky was as embarrassed by its success as he was delighted with it and justly proud of his achievement. But it's the "obviousness" of Stravinsky's masterpiece, the way it hides its subtleties behind its red-raw facade that has astonished and endeared it to the wider public. The "scandal" gave it a notoriety before most people had heard a note of it, made people want to hear it, and created a demand for performances that comparable works didn't enjoy.

This was how it was able to attract the attention of younger composers - Carter, I'm sure, would have had a similar experience had he heard the Schönberg Orchestral Pieces, but that work wasn't performed nearly as frequently as Le Sacre. This is not in any way meant to "belittle" a masterpiece that stomps its critics to a gory pulp and which continues to intrigue, compel and overwhelm its performers and listeners - I rather wish to "be-biggen" Debussy etc.

[teamsaint]

Re AH and Ferney's posts, the whole business of the development of music at that time is fascinating.

And this is a brilliant site to help guide the explorer.

http://www.tonalsoft.com/enc/v/vienna.aspx

(posted this previously, but it is relevant. I have a couple of days off, looks like holiday reading to me. After those doors are painted...)

[ahinton]

It is of true that there are other works that are at least as "ground-breaking" as Le Sacre (and I would add Webern's opera 5 - 10 to your list - I wrote in awed tones about Debussy's achievement in Jeux only a fortnight ago, on the centenary of its premiere) and Stravinsky was as embarrassed by its success as he was delighted with it and justly proud of his achievement. But it's the "obviousness" of Stravinsky's masterpiece, the way it hides its subtleties behind its red-raw facade that has astonished and endeared it to the wider public. The "scandal" gave it a notoriety before most people had heard a note of it, made people want to hear it, and created a demand for performances that comparable works didn't enjoy.

My "list" was not, of course, intended to be comprehensive and was little more than arbitrary, but I think it also fair to say that the Le Sacre "scandal" and the notoriety that followed it had rather more of its oriogins in the choreography than in the music, actually.

[pastoralguy]

Now I have the Sony 10 CD box and, worse, the Decca 20 CD box to work through ....

I have them both too, Dougie, and I'm going to try to listen to as many as possible over the next three days as possible. (Having taken time off work to do so!)

I'm not sure who will crack first - me or the neighbours!



My favourite performance was Salonen with the Philharmonia at the Edinburgh Festival two years ago. It really did blow me away. I've played it a couple of times too and have been removed from the first violin section and found guilty of GBH!!!

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

My "list" was not, of course, intended to be comprehensive and was little more than arbitrary, but I think it also fair to say that the Le Sacre "scandal" and the notoriety that followed it had rather more of its oriogins in the choreography than in the music, actually.

Yes: the involvement of the Ballet Russes, and Diaghilev's publicity nous certainly helped ensure public interest. Now, if only he'd been involved in the skandalkonzert in Vienna on March 31st!

[Flosshilde]

[Ed: I have moved some posts here so as not to disrupt discussion about the Rite of Spring by people who appreciate the music. On reflection, I would prefer not to have approved a post which simply wished to reiterate, yet again, how much a particular poster hated it. ff]

Which requires a password - just so that I can satisfy my idle (or morbid, as my mother would say) curiosity, what is the password, ff?

Ta, and apologies for disrupting the discussion.

Ed: The reason is that search engines can't crawl p/w protected forums. Just in case they can read - I'll PM it to you.

[jayne lee wilson]

The premiere of Le Sacre is both legend and myth - a musically & choreographically revolutionary event (pace AH's qualifiers) and, intentionally or not, an early example of performance art pour epater les bourgeois, a shockvalue which in part led to the demand, from early performances to recent vast boxsets. But you COULD actually hear and understand it as a symphonic poem about the Russian Spring, the "whole earth cracking open" as IS said. As fhg implied, all great works suffer from repetition and dilution in some respect, all change their meanings and positions as the culture around them changes.

But of course Le Sacre (and not only Le Sacre) is played and recorded too often (far too often) - it's now a common calling card, a concerto for an orchestra on tour, a showing-off. Can the notes - or what lies beyond the notes - have any meaning left under that onslaught? I still remember my first time with it - Stravinsky's own on a Columbia LP - the intense experience of the ancient, the modern, dancing together. If, as with The Ring, I can avoid it for long enough, I might be able to "hear" or feel it, again, with something of its primeval, evocative power and strangeness. Which may have little to do with the myth, or legend, of its first performance.

Whatever The Rite of Spring has become - a display piece, or a glassbeadgame of comparative interpretation, I can't help feeling a little sad about its present status.

[Alison]

I do urge anyone feeling jaded or weary of the piece to try Philharmonia/Salonen on Thursday.

If the centenary occasion brings about even just a little extra, we should be in for a real treat.

[Flosshilde]

Ed: The reason is that search engines can't crawl p/w protected forums. Just in case they can read - I'll PM it to you.

Received, ta. Very trivial of me, I know.

On topic - Mr Flossie gave me a book a couple of Christmases ago - 'First nights' (http://www.amazon.co.uk/First-Nights...s=first+nights), including an examination of the Rite first night. Well worth reading. It would seem that expectations of something unusual were stoked up rather, although the semi-public dress rehearsal was a success with the invited audience. One wonders if opening the programme with Les sylphide didn't help matters much - the contrast must have contributed to the shock of the Rite. I think Diagalev must have been well satisfied with the publicity, especially as the second performance went off quite peacefully.

[Petrushka]

I do urge anyone feeling jaded or weary of the piece to try Philharmonia/Salonen on Thursday.

If the centenary occasion brings about even just a little extra, we should be in for a real treat.

Alas, I may not be able to catch this live so will record it and listen on Friday, though there is an outside chance I'll be in time to catch the Rite.

I've been to some memorable performances over the years: Muti and the Philharmonia in 1979 when I was ill with flu; Haitink and the BPO on a Saturday morning May Day Europa Concert in 1993; Rattle and the BPO interrupted by a mobile phone and restarted; Igor Markevich and the LSO in (I think) 1980, IM seated and barely moving; Tilson Thomas and the BPO in Berlin 1980; Rozhdestvensky and the BBCSO, First Night of the Proms in 1981 when one of the timpanists sticks went flying up in the air (anyone remember this?). There's something about a live performance that still makes it a 'happening', a real event, where anything can go wrong. Remember the Prom in 2010 when Gatti and the Orchestre National de France had a real motorway pile up in the Procession of the Sage?

No. I never feel jaded about the piece though months can go by without hearing it. Recently been assessing some recordings not heard for ages such as Levine MET Orch, Rattle CBSO and Boulez Cleveland.

[Petrushka]

I commemorated the event by listening again to my favourite performance - a live recording of the concert with the LSO and Pierre Monteux which was performed on the 50th anniversary in london.
what a performance. I was always surprised that this recording never made it onto the BBC Legends series.
slarty

And here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc4X4kizP5c

Think I'll play this tomorrow night instead. Thanks for alerting us to it.

[Richard Tarleton]

Anybody got any special memories of what this work means to them or of memorable performances? When was the first time you heard it?

My first and only live Rite was a performance of the Kenneth Macmillan choreography by the Royal Ballet at Covent Garden in 1972. The Chosen Maiden was danced spectacularly by Deanne Bergsma, the South African dancer who happened to be exceptionally tall for a ballerina. There was an interesting discussion on the radio the other day about dancing this role by Monica Mason (who first danced it in the Macmillan production) and Deborah Bull.

I haven't been to the ballet for about 40 years, am not a balletomane, but went to several Royal Ballet performances around this time. Tickets were cheap and it was fascinating to observe the completely different crowd (to the opera crowd I was used to) in the Crush Bar.

Any other memories of seeing it as a ballet? I've never been back to hear it in a concert.

HvK brought the BPO to London in '72 - 2 concerts back-to-back. Pastoral/Heldenleben, which is on Testament, and Mozart Divertimento/Rite, which may be. I couldn't get tickets but listened on R3.

[MrGongGong]

I'm quite keen on this version

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bntEvGmmD0M

(Starts at 32:04)

if you are after an alternative ?

But the best live one for me was Gurgiev with the Kirov at the RFH about 10 years ago ...... which had a really interesting and unusual balance between the strings and the wind.

[Petrushka]

And here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qc4X4kizP5c

Think I'll play this tomorrow night instead. Thanks for alerting us to it.

I've just played this on youTube and it is a very, very impressive performance indeed. As an antidote to the 'concerto for orchestra' performance this is fine. Monteux is slower than you find today but detail tells and he never forgets that this is ballet music. Recommend this with all possible enthusiasm.

It would make a fascinating addition to the ICA catalogue and they should snap up this historical document without delay. Hope ICA Classics are reading this.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I'm quite keen on this version

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bntEvGmmD0M

Played the Columbia SO recording conducted by the composer. I haven't heard The Rite in years, and this sounded as fresh and vital and as bloody astonishing as it did when I first heard it (Christmas 1976) - so, yes, Jayne: it is possible!

Fantastic work - "news that stays news" to paraphrase Pound. Many thanks, papa Igor!