Tchaikovsky's Symphonies.

[BBMmk2]

With the advice from EA, I thought it be a good idea to begin a Tchaik Symphony thread.

Some members, i know, seem to disregard his first three symphonies, but i find that they are rather good but need a different handling than with 4 - 6 and i include Manfred too.

My mainstay is the cycle that Mariss Jansons did for Chandos, quite a few years ago now. Petrenko, i have a few, I dont know about Jarvi's(Neeme). Claudio abbado I have with the 6th and i also have Andrew Litton's cycle as well.

[Madame Suggia]

A lucky late night find for me recently was a second hand set of Svetlanov's Tchaikovsky Symphony cycle on Canyon Classics for £20.

It really is superb

[jayne lee wilson]

Dead lucky there Suggsy! I have that cycle too (live 1990), but if I can one-up-woman you, this is the original HDCD issue... I'll never forget the impact one July evening playing 1 & 6 for the first time - some of the first Japanese Specials I ever got. It is a great cycle. Even the very audible air-conditioning adds to the atmosphere...

I bought them separately (rather more expensively) from Tokyo HMV and others. But never got No.3... last seen at about £150 2ndhand...

Which one is yours? There have been issues from Holland, and latterly on Exton (excellent reports). It featured on the Warners Svetlanov Edition too as CD only, never heard that but sent back others in the same edition on SQ grounds...

Svetlanov's 1967 USSRSO cycle is great if you like that blaring echtsoviet brass ... any number of rereleases, if you find the Aulos (eau-de-nil/offwhite box) one anywhere, grab it!

Love Dorati/LSO in the early symphonies. Don't think Nos. 1-3 have ever been better done.

[BBMmk2]

In your opinion, JLW, on the symphonies 1-3(or any others boarders opinions?))

[Alain Maréchal]

Much as I enjoy that Dorati/LSO cycle, I find a lot of it hard-driven. I prefer Markevich with the same orchestra. For no 2 on its own, my choice would be Svetlanov/USSRSO - irresistable impetus in the finale (superb piccolo playing). I'm not sure to which Svetlanov recordings the above remarks refer, but I have the HMV/Melodiya LPs, and I understand that they not been transferred well to CD. I'll throw in a good word for van Otterloo and the Residentie Orkest in No 4.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I wrote an essay on Tchaikovsky's symphonies when at university, beginning somewhat provocatively: "Tchaikovsky's eight symphonies..."
The red crossing-out of "eight" was followed shortly afterwards by a "sorry".
The seventh was the 7th to be composed, with the Pathetique as the 8th in the EA numbering. It later became the 3rd Piano Concerto, but the reconstructed symphony is well worth hearing. I still have the Ormandy LP recording.

[Petrushka]

Svetlanov's 1967 USSRSO cycle is great if you like that blaring echtsoviet brass

Nothing wrong with that! I rather like 'blaring echt-soviet brass' and will look out for this. The only integrated cycle I have is Karajan at least until Jurowski completes his LPO traversal.

I don't have any problem at all with no's 1 or 2 but the 3rd Symphony is truly terrible (imv) and the snag with buying a cycle means another 3rd I don't need!

[Ferretfancy]

Nobody has mentioned the Mavrinsky / Leningrad PO recording of 4,5 & 6. I haven't heard his mono recording, but the stereo set recorded in London by DG is still one to reckon with.

[jayne lee wilson]

Much as I enjoy that Dorati/LSO cycle, I find a lot of it hard-driven. I prefer Markevich with the same orchestra. For no 2 on its own, my choice would be Svetlanov/USSRSO - irresistable impetus in the finale (superb piccolo playing). I'm not sure to which Svetlanov recordings the above remarks refer, but I have the HMV/Melodiya LPs, and I understand that they not been transferred well to CD. I'll throw in a good word for van Otterloo and the Residentie Orkest in No 4.

The 3 complete Svetlanov cycles I'm aware of are:
1)Moscow Radio Large Hall 1967 with USSRSO on Melodiya. Best remasterings are the Aulos Classics one and probably the 2005-7 Melodiya - I say probably because I've never heard it, but from around 2005 Melodiya issued excellent remasters of eg. Kondrashin's Shostakovitch, Rozhdestvensky's Sibelius, Svetlanov's Brahms etc., all of which utterly belied those earlier harsh & edgy affairs on BMG/Melodiya etc. The Tchaikovsky probably sounds good too, but only separate issues seem available now.

2) Tokyo live 1990 with USSRSO on (Pony) Canyon Classics. Issued on 3 HDCDs originally, later as a Dutch-sourced CD-only box, and recently on Exton. Also a part of the Svetlanov Warners' Edition as CD-only but probably not the best sound. Performances of striking power, drama and passion. VERY live & atmospheric! Some separate discs still around - all good!

3) Moscow Radio Large Hall 1992 with USSRSO on Canyon Classics as HDCDs. Notably slower tempi than the live 1990 one, stunning sound, sometimes feels like an analysis or x-ray of the music, rather than a performance. R&J and Italian Caprice come off very well... string tone in the serenade glistens marvellously.
Lacking the drama of 1990 but still a good listen (especially for audiophiles).

Other Svetlanov issues are very numerous and often baffling in their provenance!

[PJPJ]

Nobody has mentioned the Mavrinsky / Leningrad PO recording of 4,5 & 6. I haven't heard his mono recording, but the stereo set recorded in London by DG is still one to reckon with.

The stereo set was made in London and in Vienna, Brent Town Hall for No 4, the Grosser Saal, Musikverein for Nos 5 and 6.

The mono set has Sanderling conducting No 4 - the mid 1950s mono recordings sound well.

[Hornspieler]

To me, the "Polish" symphony (Nº 3) is out of character with the other Tchaikowsy symphonies, which are all recognisable as the composer's output.

Even "Manfred", which I have played many times - first under Beecham and later under Silvestri, have that stirring "portrait of 19th century Russia" feeling.

I'm not decrying the "Polish". It is a fine work, but for me, it could just as easily have been written by any of Tchaikowsky's contempories.

Does anyone else feel that it is the "Odd Man Out" - more so than "Manfred"?

HS

[Alain Maréchal]

I'm rather fond of No. 3. I think one just has to accept it as less symphonic. It has all the hallmarks, such as unexpected solo trombone counter-melodies (which always sound better for a little vibrato, rather as though the player has been in the bar for just a little too long), delicacy and great beauty. There is a fine Boult recording - he was of the opinion that Tchaikovsky went better if hysteria was avoided, most of AB's recordings of Tchaikovsky seem to prove this, and Markevich understands it.

Thanks to JLW for that summary of reissues - and on the subject of Melodiya reissues does anybody (I Imagine it would be JLW) know if Kondrashin's recording of Rachmaninov's Symphonic Dances has been well transferred anywhere? I had to buy two LPs just to be sure I always had a good copy in reserve, since I knew I would play it often.

Soviet brass is perhaps heard to better effect in Glazunov symphonies, where there is less bombast and more opportunities for cantabile playing (try Ivanov in No. 5).

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

The Polish was a BaL feature quite recently. I rather like it, but find the finale too brash.

As far as Russian recordings go, I tend to avoid them. The very thought of a wobbly horn in the 2nd movement of the 5th turns me into a madman. A pity, because Russian string playing is really special.

[Thropplenoggin]

The Polish was a BaL feature quite recently. I rather like it, but find the finale too brash.

As far as Russian recordings go, I tend to avoid them. The very thought of a wobbly horn in the 2nd movement of the 5th turns me into a madman. A pity, because Russian string playing is really special.

C'est le mot juste. Just when I'm beginning to think I could really warm to Tchaikovsky, a painfully sibilant and seemingly endless series of cymbal crashes breaks out and reminds me why my feelings towards his music remain rather cool.

[salymap]

To me, the "Polish" symphony (Nº 3) is out of character with the other Tchaikowsy symphonies, which are all recognisable as the composer's output.

Even "Manfred", which I have played many times - first under Beecham and later under Silvestri, have that stirring "portrait of 19th century Russia" feeling.

I'm not decrying the "Polish". It is a fine work, but for me, it could just as easily have been written by any of Tchaikowsky's contempories.

Does anyone else feel that it is the "Odd Man Out" - more so than "Manfred"?

HS

I prefer Manfred to no 3 HS but unfortunately a CD of Manfred which was given me has been lost/mislaid. I'm sure I lent to my local cousin - he says he doesn't remember.

It's the first and last time,I hope and Manfred never seems to be broadcast much if ever.