Howard Goodall on BBC Two

[Nick Armstrong]

It'll be good to get more comments on this. Opinion seems to have shifted since the start of the series when a few people said how much they enjoyed it.

That may be because it seems to me to have come off the rails. I caught up last night with Eps 2, 3 & 4 (haven't seen the one that was actually broadcast yesterday which I think was #5?).

I thought the first two, up to the end of the baroque, were good. But then with the third one, it all veered off into much less compelling 'schools history' style coupled with (I thought) a jarring agenda towards the end of #4 to debunk Wagner and all his works. I hold no particular candle for RW but I thought this strayed off course in a rather odd way, and took up time which could have allowed more interesting ground to be covered.

I switched channels last night and saw briefly - in a programme I thought was about serialism - reference to Scott Joplin. I'll be interested to see how that fits when I watch the programme. (I concede it was interesting that HG identified Liszt as the creator of the 12-tone row. How do serial fans here react to that?)

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

(I concede it was interesting that HG identified Liszt as the creator of the 12-tone row. How do serial fans here react to that?)

Well this one wasn't impressed - Mozart got there much earlier.

[mercia]

HG identified Liszt as the creator of the 12-tone row. How do serial fans here react to that?

we've rubbished that one already

[Nick Armstrong]

Well this one wasn't impressed - Mozart got there much earlier.

I'd welcome a Mozartean pointer!

[vinteuil]

Well this one wasn't impressed - Mozart got there much earlier.

... not to mention Bach who was on to that sort of thing in the b minor fugue of the WTC (the 48) book one.

[Nick Armstrong]

we've rubbished that one already

Oh have we? I started post #196 about 4 hours ago, kept getting distracted... (had to put out a Feuer, for instance )

UPDATE: Can't see a post dealing with the Liszt allegation. Which one were you thinking of mercs?

Were any other of HG's strenuous claims for Liszt bunkum?

PS he did concede that Wagner "wrote much better tunes" I suppose...

[mercia]

UPDATE: Can't see a post dealing with the Liszt allegation. Which one were you thinking of mercs?

sort of #154/5

[MrGongGong]

Ok
I made it all up
Serialism was a mistake, an aberration and a total cul-de-sac in musical history
all of it is tosh, utter rubbish and took listeners away from the central purpose of ALL music (not just in the West either)
which is to be this ........

http://www.classicfm.com/shop/digital-albums/relaxing-classics/

anything else is simply misguided

Now we have got that clear
which André Rieu CD should I start my collection with ?
O and anyone want to buy a large collection of Ligeti, Harvey and random electroacoustic CD's ?

[gurnemanz]

I'd welcome a Mozartean pointer!

I can remember Hans Keller quoting a section of the final movement of the G Minor Symphony which contains a twelve-tone row.

[MrGongGong]

I can remember Hans Keller quoting a section of the final movement of the G Minor Symphony which contains a twelve-tone row.

That's because it's a Fundamentally GOOD IDEA

[LeMartinPecheur]

Amongst quite a few questionable statements last night I particularly enjoyed the reference to Tchaikovsky's symphonism following Brahmsian models. I'm confident Pyotr Il'ych would have said a few choice words to Mr Goodall on that score!

[Roehre]

That's because it's a Fundamentally GOOD IDEA

Most be the one piece of Mozart's I like then

[Roehre]

Amongst quite a few questionable statements last night I particularly enjoyed the reference to Tchaikovsky's symphonism following Brahmsian models. I'm confident Pyotr Il'ych would have said a few choice words to Mr Goodall on that score!

I am confident one Pyotr Il'ych is spinning in his grave now

[MrGongGong]

Most be the one piece of Mozart's I like then

Mozarts "Musical Dice" is the Albatross of Stochastic Music

[Mr Pee]

Serialism was a mistake, an aberration and a total cul-de-sac in musical history

At last.

But that doesn't mean that the only alternative music (singular) is Andre Rieu or Relaxing Classics. I'm sure if you make a bit of an effort you can find a "note event" you can enjoy that doesn't sound like the cat's got stuck in the chimney.