Brahms: Piano concerti nos 1 & 2

[BBMmk2]

Ah, I always think I must buy those ones, Barbs!

[Barbirollians]

The Brahms Piano Concertos

Having heard them back to back last night at Sheffield City Hall with Sunwook Kim and the Halle conducted by Mark Elder I as struck by just how much better a piece the Second Concerto seemed - much more conversationAL interplay between soloist and orchestra - leaving aside the duo with cello in the third movement , better tunes and much more interesting orchestration .

It surprised me as I do not think I had ever listened to them back to back before . It is not to say I do not love the First especially when in a great performance it attains an epic quality e.g Curzon/Szell but last night the Second seemed much the greater work .

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Yes - I have always preferred the Second Concerto to the First; but then, I think that Brahms' works get better as he gets older. (And, as I get older, I increasingly prefer lyricism to rhetoric ... if that makes any sense?)

I don't know the First Piano Concerto nearly well enough to be able to make any comment on whether it is "as great", or "greater" (or otherwise) than the Second - but, FWiW, the idea of spending time listening to and "analysing" the Second is a far more attractive prospect for me than doing so with the First.


(And - also FWiW) the prospect of spending time listening to and "analysing" Brahms' First Piano Concerto is a far more attractive prospect for me than doing so with most other Piano Concertos of the mid-late 19th Century.)

[Barbirollians]

Somewhat surprised there are no other views on these !

[Richard Barrett]

Somewhat surprised there are no other views on these !

There are very few pieces by Brahms that I like and these certainly aren't among them.

[Bryn]

I have long found the Second far more rewarding than the First. I recall seeking Cornelius Cardew's opinion of the Second (he shared a birthday with Brahms and Tchaikovsky). He feigned not to know the work, as he did re. Schubert's final symphony (that's one way of getting round the alternative numbering systems). Possibly my own preference for Brahms's Second Piano Concerto was conditioned by a truly drab performance of the First I attended at the RAH in my late teens. The pianist on that occasion was one Alfred Brendel. Clearly this was an 'off night' for him. It put me off bothering with his performances for quite a while. Indeed, it was only through listening to his inspiring lecture on humour in music* that my interest in listening to his playing was resumed. Much lost time has since been made up. My favourite recording of the work is the Gilels/CSO/Reiner, available on an IMG Reiner double CD album:



* The frequently delivered lecture may be found in a double DVD set.

[Nick Armstrong]

Having heard them back to back last night at Sheffield City Hall with Sunwook Kim and the Halle conducted by Mark Elder I as struck by just how much better a piece the Second Concerto seemed

I would love to have heard this concert. I still regularly watch my DVD of Sunwook Kim's performance of the First with the same forces which won him the Leeds competition - Elder's delight at Kim's performance is very evident from his words in the green room as they come off-stage before going back to take the continuing applause. It's no surprise that Sir Mark should have been up for this concert! That Leeds performance is one of my favourite versions of the piece.

I'm the only person I know who prefers the First to the Second, having known both for getting on for 30 years...!

[BBMmk2]

I still find that the classic Emil Gilels and the Berliners, with Jochum, a hard one to beat but having said, a recent BaL, didn't giver them much credence?

[Barbirollians]

I still find that the classic Emil Gilels and the Berliners, with Jochum, a hard one to beat but having said, a recent BaL, didn't giver them much credence?

I think the reviewer thought them too slow - I think they are marvellous .

[BBMmk2]

I think the reviewer thought them too slow - I think they are marvellous .

As do I :) Plus a lot of other people!

[rauschwerk]

I still find that the classic Emil Gilels and the Berliners, with Jochum, a hard one to beat but having said, a recent BaL, didn't giver them much credence?

I'm very suspicious of that 'classic' epithet. To my ears, Curzon and Szell are so slow in the Adagio that the notes barely cohere into a line. And I find myself wishing that in the second subject of the first movement, Gilels would just get on with playing the tune in a straightforward manner. The BaL 1st concerto winner was Freire/Chailly, which is magnificent in every way and superbly recorded to boot.

[Nick Armstrong]

I still find that the classic Emil Gilels and the Berliners, with Jochum, a hard one to beat but having said, a recent BaL, didn't giver them much credence?

The Gilels/Jochum has been my touchstone since I bought it on cassette c 1981. No one quite touches them in the slow movement.

It's a mark of the merits of the Sunwook Kim / Elder performance in Leeds that they come very close indeed.

It's the only work in which I've ever really liked a Zimerman recording, too - with Rattle.

[BBMmk2]

Zimmermann/Rattle, Cali? That does sound too ideal! :)

[kea]

I like the First Piano Concerto. It's a very convincing essay in the Romantic "single extended movement" concertante genre that probably started with Weber's Konzertstück, and packs a great deal into its 20-minute span. What those two other bits of music they play after it are, and what they have to do with it, I have no idea.

>_>

[aeolium]

I always found it slightly strange that Radu Lupu only recorded (and perhaps has only ever performed in public) the first of Brahms' concertos and not the second since the latter seems the more lyrical work. It's a pity as he is so good in the late piano pieces. Of the more recent recordings of the B flat concerto, I like Abbado with Pollini and the VPO - also on DVD in a live performance.