Brahms: Piano concerti nos 1 & 2

[richardfinegold]

Oh yes! It's been years since I last heard these: must see if I can find copies.

Superb sounding reissue a few years ago on Sony

[mathias broucek]

I have far too many versions of both concertos but if I had to keep only one set it would be my introduction to the works - the magnificent Gilels/Jochum set. Though they would be dragging Curzon/Szell No1 and Richter/Leinsdorf in 2 and most of all Solomon's recordings of both out of my fingers !

I have nothing to add to this!

[Hornspieler]

I do seem to have quite a few versions! Apart from Gilels, here are three sets I would not want to be without -Katchen/ LSO Monteux, Fleischer / Cleveland Szell, and Solomon /Philh.Kubelik. Of single recordings there are Curzon in No. 1, and Richter in No. 2. More recently, there's a splendid Emmanuel Ax performance of No.2 with the BSO and Haitink.

My first acquaintance with the music of Brahms was the main theme of the first symphony finale introducing "Childrens' Hour" with Helen Henschel, but it was Solomon's 1947 recording of the second concerto with the Philharmonia orchestra under Issay Dobrowen and those opening notes by my hero, Dennis Brain, that really got me hooked.

I now have that recording transferred onto CD by Testament SBT 1042

I first heard the D minor concerto, also with the Philharmonia, played by Claudio Arrau in the Royal Albert Hall (Up in the gallery, so I heard it twicw!)

Since then I have played both many times - both the 1st and 3rd horn parts and my outright winner will always be Julius Katchen in both concerti. I have Gilels (VG) and Ashkenazy (when I can find it) and have also played with Ogden, Hans Richter Hasser, Kovacevich (Stephen Bishop) John Lill Gina Bachauer and Robin Wood (Canadian pianist)

The performances by Emanuel Ax on the 2011 Proms nearly put me off for life, but I have survived the trauma of that atrocious piano playing (cue to shoot me down here) and these are still for me the ultimate examples of a perfect blend of solo piano and orchestral writing.

HS

Afterthought: The 2nd concerto is, I suppose, the major of the two works but, in some ways, I prefer the 1st (D minor in preference to B flat major?)

[BBMmk2]

Like Alison, I've come to appreciate these works as I've got older, in my case into my mid-fifties. I have a marked preference for the 2nd over the 1st but greatly enjoy both. I seem to have acquired quite a few versions in recent years and have the Gilels/BPO/Jochum, Arrau/Concertgebouw/Haitink, Pollini/BPO/Abbado, and Brendel/BPO/Abbado in both concertos. Among single issues of the 1st PC I have Rubinstein/Chicago SO/Reiner while of the 2nd PC I have Anda/BPO/Karajan, Fischer/BPO/Furtwängler, Anda/Cologne RSO/Klemperer and, my favourite Brahms PC recording of all, Backhaus/VPO/Böhm.

I was also present at the Ax/COE/Haitink Proms in 2011.

Was'nt that cycle of Brahms/Ax/CoE/Haitink superb! And I suspect that, evenm better live! I dont suppose they be a recording of these? Some of thye other recrodings mentioned, woul;d certainl;y be worth considering!

[Tony Halstead]

Hornspieler's verdict:
"The performances by Emanuel Ax on the 2011 Proms nearly put me off for life, but I have survived the trauma of that atrocious piano playing (cue to shoot me down here) "

Brassbandmaestro's verdict:
"Was'nt that cycle of Brahms/Ax/CoE/Haitink superb! And I suspect that, evenm better live!"



It reminds me of the noticeboard backstage at the RFH in the late 1950s-1960s ( maybe even 1970s) managed by the then C.E.O, Mr T.E. Bean, with a heading 'Point and Counterpoint'.
Bean used to pin up various newspaper reviews that were - as above - diametrically opposed, to the great amusement of the various backstage musicians.

[Don Petter]

It reminds me of the noticeboard backstage at the RFH in the late 1950s-1960s ( maybe even 1970s) managed by the then C.E.O, Mr T.E. Bean, with a heading 'Point and Counterpoint'.
Bean used to pin up various newspaper reviews that were - as above - diametrically opposed, to the great amusement of the various backstage musicians.

I remember reading these, so they must have also been published. One source suggests they were in the monthly RFH newsletter, but I don't think I ever saw this. Were they sometimes put in the back of concert programmes?

[Stanfordian]

I what clossus these concerti are! they seem quite unsrumountable but are real true ,asterpieces of the Romantic Piano Concerto.

It would be interesting to find out what other board members thinbk of these concerti?And performances you own?

I have that classic of classics, imo, of Emil Gilels/Berliner Philharmoniker/Eugen Jochum and nelson Friere too.

Hiya Brassbandmaestro,

I agree that the accounts of the Brahms piano concertos from Emil Gilels/Berliner Philharmoniker/Eugen Jochum on DG are excellent. Alongside them I greatly admire the stunning accounts played by Leon Fleisher with the Cleveland Symphony Orchestra/George Szell on Sony Classical Masterworks Heritage MH2K 63225.

[Barbirollians]

I should also very much hate to be without Rubinstein in these pieces. I think he really excelled in Brahms - I love his solo piano and chamber music recordings of Brahms too - indeed that was how I got to know the piano quartets .

The Reiner Brahms 1 is special and I have a great deal of time for the Brahms 2 with Krips . I have never heard the recording of Brahms 1 that he made with Mehta when he was 90 !!! but the Brahms 2 with Ormandy is treasurable if by no means a library choice- such playing from an 85 year old seems impossible. There is a chamber music quality about it .

The ICA Classics live Brahms 2 with Dohnanyi is also terrific - from 1966 and with rather more fizz.

[Nick Armstrong]

I have that classic of classics, imo, of Emil Gilels/Berliner Philharmoniker/Eugen Jochum

I too have this set, bbm, like many others here - but I have never got on with the performance of No 2 anything like as much as the way they play No. 1 which is one of the great performances of anything, imho.

But they are very different pieces, as hinted by Belgrove above, and by HS, whose afterthought here I don't think I agree with:

Afterthought: The 2nd concerto is, I suppose, the major of the two works but, in some ways, I prefer the 1st (D minor in preference to B flat major?)

I've heard the 2nd referred to in 'monumental' terms - but I've never heard it like that. To my ears it's almost the 'feminine' counterpart to the 'masculine' No 1 (to this extent I have a similar sensation about the Chopin concertos).

And as such, my experience is that the performers who play No 1 well don't necessarily play No 2 as well - as I find with Gilels & Co.

In No 2 I've always preferred Richter/Leinsdorf.

I have two other favourite performances of No 1 - both rather surprising. One is the Zimerman/Rattle recording - neither among my favourite artists, but somehow with the VPO and a terrific recording, it really works for me: http://www.amazon.com/Brahms-Piano-C.../dp/B0007IK4L0. And the other is a DVD of the winning Leeds Piano Competition finals performance by Sunwook Kim and the Hallé under Elder - really mesmerising! (A kind friend at the BBC made me a DVD of it, as I'd missed it on the TV). There are clips on YouTube but the sound quality is so terrible I haven't added links.

[Barbirollians]

I prefer the Second to be honest . I recall very clearly hearing those opening bars in a BAL in the 1980s and going out ang buying the big gatefold sleeve Gilels/Jochum mid priced set.

[Petrushka]

I prefer the Second to be honest . I recall very clearly hearing those opening bars in a BAL in the 1980s and going out ang buying the big gatefold sleeve Gilels/Jochum mid priced set.

Yes, I too prefer the Second PC by some margin. Calban is right to think of it as a 'feminine' counterpart to the 'masculine 'First' and perhaps that explains why I like it so much. The First is a tougher nut to crack and probably put me off investigating these concertos for several years.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Yes, the Second for me, too. Not because of "masculine/feminine" divide (I've never met any masculines or feminines that match such opposites) but rather a preference for mature lyricism over youthful drama. Wouldn't want to give up either, mind you.

[Richard Tarleton]

I have a marked preference for the 2nd over the 1st but greatly enjoy both.

My sentiments entirely. I first heard 2 with Brendel and the Philharmonia under Schmidt-Isserstedt in 1971, and fell in love with it. That horn solo - marvellous. I love Brahms's concertos but less so the symphonies.

My only recordings Pollini/VPO/Abbado.

[Don Petter]

I have a great liking for the Serkin/Ormandy No.2, which, after a number of incarnations on LP, has been briefly available on Sony CD. Much better than the later Serkin/Szell. The sound is somewhat of its period, but the performance ...

[Nick Armstrong]

It's the 1st that does it for me, every time.