Karajanophobia; is there a cure?

[Dave2002]

HvK's recordings of Beethoven 9 (most of the versions, even including the digital one), and recordings of Schumann symphonies are among the best ever.

[Beef Oven]

As always - the depth and quality of all your response to this discussion, is overwhelming. I am now set to reinvestigate HvK - and greatly looking forward to doing so. I had no idea he'd recorded any RVW. That will be interesting.

Another chapter thus opens in my enjoyment of the rich world of music. Thanks to all.

When my iPod died last year, these were the first 20 HvK recordings that I uploaded to my new player:

1.Schoenberg, Berg ,Webern 3 CD box set (2nd Viennese)
2. Beethoven 9 1963 BPO Live
3. Mahler 4 Galleria
4. Das Lied von der erde Galleria
5. Brahms 1, Schoenberg Verklarte Nacht, RFH 1988 Testament
6. Beethoven Overtures 2 CDs Galleria
7. Bruckner 8 BPO EMI 1958
8. Bartok Concerto for Orchestra & Music for Strings Percussion and Celeste - Galleria
9. Debussy La Mer, Prelude A L'apres midi d'un Faun, Ravel Bolero & Daphne Suit 2 - Galleria
10. Opera Intermezzi DG 1968
11. Bruckner 9 - 1966 - Galleria
12. Mozart Eine Kleine Nachtmusik, Serenata notturna D-dur & divertimento KV 287 - DG digital 1982-88
13. Respighi Fontane Di Roma, Pini Di Roma Antiche Danze Ed Arie Suite 3 DG The Originals
14. Nielsen 4 & Sibelius Tapiola DG
15. Debussy Pelleas et Melisande EMI Great Recordings of the Century
16. Turandot VPO - DG
17. Mahler 9 BPO Live 1982 DG
18. Shostakovich 10 - Digital DG version
19. Strauss 4 Last songs, Tod und Verklarung, Metamorphosen - DG Originals
20. Franz Liszt Hungarian Dances, Rhapsodies, Hungarian Folk Fantasy & Mephisto Waltz

Can't remember why Parsifal, Bruckner #8 VPO, other Testament and other earlier EMI recordings did not go on first - they're on there now!

P.S. a very orthodox list!

[makropulos]

Start with Honegger 2 & 3, HvK's at his very best, to my ears.

I'm a partial -phobe as well (for Mozart, Beethoven, Schumann, Mendelssohn, Brahms, Wagner and most Strauss I would always look elsewhere).
BUT he was a great musician, and there are tremendous things:
Agree entirely about the Honegger disc (and there's earlier live Honegger 3 on Dynamic that is very exciting too).
I've also a great fondness for his Decca/VPO Planets which I still find wonderful.
By chance I came across his (later) EMI Sibelius 4 and was blown away by it.

The EMI Rosenkavalier has some moments of absolute magic, as does his Hansel & Gretel (also EMI). Some excellent Verdi as well - I think HvK in the opera house is rather more impressive proposition in general.

[Hornspieler]

I was subject to the syndrome for about 40 years, owning very few discs (eg Mahler 6, Metamorphosen + Janowitz Four last Songs). When that absurdly priced Symphony box came up, I was encouraged to take the plunge. I have not relished everything in it but have found much to enjoy - Bruckner, Mendelssohn, Schumann. It would be rather surprising if someone who was principal conductor of one of the world's great orchestras for several decades had produced nothing worth hearing.

For me, the 1961/2 Collector's Edition [DG 463 088-2] of the nine Beethoven Symphonies with the Berlin Symphony Orchestra is unsurpassable. Even the ninth symphony (the one I hate) is superbly performed and the singers, Gundula Janowitz, Hilde Rössel-Majdan, Waldemar Kmentt and Walter Berry make a most impressive solo 4tet.

Has anyone ever played the Eroica as superbly as this? Tell me about it.

I also have HvK's Richard Strauss Tone poems [DG 447 441-2] recorded in 1973. I can't imagine any orchestra or any conductor performing them better.

For all his faults, he was a GREAT conductor IMV. (I am listening to that Eroica even now as I write)

HS

[Ferretfancy]

I would put his first stereo recording of Heldenleben very high up my all time list, ditto his first stereo of Shostakovich 10. There was something special about his earlier work, including the Columbia set of Beethoven symphonies with the Philharmonia which preceded the 1962 DG set, Then, what about the opera recordings for Decca? Aida with Tebaldi and Bergonzi stands out, and I have an affection for the Otello with Tebaldi and the VPO and the Leontyne Price Tosca. The engineering alone would recommend them.

[umslopogaas]

Since no-one has mentioned Karajan's Sibelius recordings (as far as I noticed in a quick skim through the replies), I will. His DG LP of the fifth was a key item for me, I bought a mono copy in WH Smiths on Waterloo Station for a few shillings back in the late sixties. The fact that it was mono was not a drawback, because I only had one speaker at the time (being a poor student), and it was a great time to discover music, because all the stores were selling off their residual mono stock dirt cheap, before everyone converted to stereo and the mono items were unsaleable. Later, when I could afford two speakers, I bought the stereo and I still have it. Just glorious, the final ride to the last timpani blows has an irresistible force. Sibelius needs no support from me, he is a great composer and Karajan can show us how great he was.

And the companion records of the sixth/seventh and fourth are pretty wonderful, too.

I'm not sure about his earlier mono recording of the fourth for Columbia (33CX 1125), but I expect its very fine. But its a long time since I played it and there are too many recordings out there to finnick around comparing them, I need to get on and play some new items.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Since no-one has mentioned Karajan's Sibelius recordings

A-HEM! He was in the list of composers with whom I thought he had particularly special insights.

I quite agree about the DG Sibelius #5 with the infuriating exception of the wrong timing for the last chords: something he did in all three of his recordings of the work ! A perfect recording otherwise: the transition from the first movement to the second, and then the steady accelerando throughout that second movement. The whole performance is elemental in its impact, as are those of the Fourth (the antipode of Beecham's "equal-but-opposite" reading of this terrifying work), Sixth and Seventh Symphonies from that period. Great stuff.

[Norfolk Born]

My HvK Sibelius 5th is coupled with 'Tapiola', and I wouldn't like to be without either performance.

[Nick Armstrong]

My HvK Sibelius 5th is coupled with 'Tapiola', and I wouldn't like to be without either performance.

I bought these performances on cassette (along with a cassette of the Abbado/Dresden Staatskapelle Brahms 3/Haydn Variations) in a sale during my first few days at University, and they accompanied me through those vivid months, and since. I share your view and others' - it's a cracking performance of Sibelius 5 to which I return despite several wonderful ones coming along in the meantime (Vanska, Levine, Saraste)

[ardcarp]

Someone (was it Tommy Beecham?) referred to Karajan as 'a sort of musical Malcolm Sargent'.

[Dave2002]

Since the DG symphony collection http://www.amazon.co.uk/Karajan-Symp...7234834&sr=1-9 seems to have become expensive, or only available as a used item, I wondered if this EMI collection is worth having - http://www.sainsburysentertainment.c...duct=E10123872 (88 CDs).

Amazon appear to have two different EMI boxed sets at slighly higher prices -

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Karajan-The-Complete-Recordings-Vol/dp/B000ZBPQEO/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1337235087&sr=1-1

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Karajan-The-Complete-Recordings-Vol/dp/B000ZBPQEE/ref=sr_1_2?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1337235148&sr=1-2

Closer inspection may reveal these to be the same as the Sainsbury offerings - orchestral and vocal.

There is also a Decca set (only 9 CDs) http://www.sainsburysentertainment.c...duct=E10123880 , and a set of vocal/operatic music. http://www.sainsburysentertainment.c...duct=E10123871 (72 CDs).

Not sure that any of this will do anything either way for Karajanophobia though.

[Hornspieler]

I would put his first stereo recording of Heldenleben very high up my all time list, ditto his first stereo of Shostakovich 10. There was something special about his earlier work, including the Columbia set of Beethoven symphonies with the Philharmonia which preceded the 1962 DG set, Then, what about the opera recordings for Decca? Aida with Tebaldi and Bergonzi stands out, and I have an affection for the Otello with Tebaldi and the VPO and the Leontyne Price Tosca. The engineering alone would recommend them.

.... and he was constantly in the Control Room, setting his own balance. Woe betide any Audio Engineer who decided to change it!

HS

[Ferretfancy]

.... and he was constantly in the Control Room, setting his own balance. Woe betide any Audio Engineer who decided to change it!

HS

Hornspieler

That was certainly true in his later career when he had complete control over every aspect, and at the same time his performances became smoother and with less character, with honourable exceptions. I don't think he was able to tinker with the balance earlier on, and especially when recording with the likes of Culshaw and others. I think the rot set in later when he virtually dictated how everything was done.

[Dave2002]

Here is a list of pieces and a review of the EMI orchestral box set - http://www.arkivmusic.com/classical/...lbum_id=186410

The Kurt Leimer concerti would seem to be rarities.

[HighlandDougie]

I'm not sure about his earlier mono recording of the fourth for Columbia (33CX 1125), but I expect its very fine.

I still listen to it (in its LP incarnation) as it really seems to get to the (very dark) heart of this great symphony. Sibelius, it is said, had the highest regard for Karajan as an interpreter of his symphonies. Can I wave a flag for the (alas, mono) Balakirev 1st Symphony with the Philharmonia? Beecham, to name but one, pales by comparison.