Paper music or electronic devices

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Eine Alpensinfonie
    Host
    • Nov 2010
    • 20570

    Paper music or electronic devices

    For many decades, I wished that there might one day be a solution to the problem of page turning for solo pianists. It’s a pain for solo pianists, but for accompaniments of other instrumentalists, the page turns are more frequent. It’s worse still for
    piano trios, and is even worse for quartets. But in Elgar’s Piano Quintet, there’s very little respite.

    So when electronic alternatives became available, I was more than a little excited. But there are drawbacks that I never anticipated:-

    Most tablet screens are much smaller than a normal printed page of music, so either the music has to be in a tiny font, or the screen image has to be changed annoyingly frequently. Therefore the player is obliged to invest in a larger tablet, such as an iPad Pro, which means quite a significant cost increase.
    Printed music enables the player to view two pages at a time, so electronic page turns, although easier, occur twice as often.
    Repeats, da capos, dal segnos, jumps to codas, etc. are equally stressful in either format.

    Repeat signs are often ill thought out by publishers. I bought a book of piano trios from a well known publisher, with page turns in the most inconsiderate of places, like 2 or 3 bars after a page turn. And don’t get me going on the current fashion for DS signs that require the player to jump back several pages, but only for a couple of lines, before jumping forward again to the coda. I ended up reformatting the score to avoid such thoughtless silliness. It resulted in more pages of music, but it’s a dream to work from, with no difficult page turns anywhere.

    But returning to topic, I know a number of musicians who rely heavily on iPad Pros and are very happy to continue.

    My gripe is with the likes of Yamaha, who advertise their electronic keyboards with photos of players posing hunched up over a tiny tablet in a shoddy posture. It’s wrong in so many ways, and it reflects badly on their excellent products.
  • Old Grumpy
    Full Member
    • Jan 2011
    • 3616

    #2
    Originally posted by Eine Alpensinfonie View Post
    For many decades, I wished that there might one day be a solution to the problem of page turning for solo pianists. It’s a pain for solo pianists, but for accompaniments of other instrumentalists, the page turns are more frequent. It’s worse still for
    piano trios, and is even worse for quartets. But in Elgar’s Piano Quintet, there’s very little respite.

    So when electronic alternatives became available, I was more than a little excited. But there are drawbacks that I never anticipated:-

    Most tablet screens are much smaller than a normal printed page of music, so either the music has to be in a tiny font, or the screen image has to be changed annoyingly frequently. Therefore the player is obliged to invest in a larger tablet, such as an iPad Pro, which means quite a significant cost increase.
    Printed music enables the player to view two pages at a time, so electronic page turns, although easier, occur twice as often.
    Repeats, da capos, dal segnos, jumps to codas, etc. are equally stressful in either format.

    Repeat signs are often ill thought out by publishers. I bought a book of piano trios from a well known publisher, with page turns in the most inconsiderate of places, like 2 or 3 bars after a page turn. And don’t get me going on the current fashion for DS signs that require the player to jump back several pages, but only for a couple of lines, before jumping forward again to the coda. I ended up reformatting the score to avoid such thoughtless silliness. It resulted in more pages of music, but it’s a dream to work from, with no difficult page turns anywhere.

    But returning to topic, I know a number of musicians who rely heavily on iPad Pros and are very happy to continue.

    My gripe is with the likes of Yamaha, who advertise their electronic keyboards with photos of players posing hunched up over a tiny tablet in a shoddy posture. It’s wrong in so many ways, and it reflects badly on their excellent products.
    Ignorant question from a very amateur singer here: With regard to repeats, da capos, jumps to codas etc, is it possible to download electronic versions of scores which just run continously from end to end, with no need to return to a previous point in the score? If so, would have thought that might provide a considerable advantage over a conventional paper score.

    Comment

    • Quarky
      Full Member
      • Dec 2010
      • 2658

      #3
      I assume it would be possible to connect the tablet to a large/ larger screen monitor, but whether it would be practical in the circumstances?
      Last edited by Quarky; 26-06-23, 09:26.

      Comment

      • Pulcinella
        Host
        • Feb 2014
        • 10941

        #4
        We seem to have two threads on the go: this current one, and this:



        Can a host kindly merge them?

        Comment

        • Dave2002
          Full Member
          • Dec 2010
          • 18016

          #5
          Originally posted by Quarky View Post
          I assume it would be possible to connect the tablet to a large screen monitor, but whether it would be practical in the circumstances?
          I suppose that could work for some choirs - with several singers "sharing" the screen.

          Many musicians now seem to use tablets [perhaps iPad Pros] with foot pedals, though as noted the screens are still smaller than many sheets of music. I have seen small ensembles and string quartets using tablets, and even recently a modest sized string orchestra. Some seem to have special "music stands" which just support a tablet screen. I have also noted mixed use of paper and tablets in some ensembles, but I think most large orchestras still stick with music.

          I'm less sure about conductors - do any of them use tablets for scores?

          There are also marketing and production issues about some scores. Some may now only be available for hire as electronic downloads - it's not something I really know much about.
          Clearly electronic downloads save a lot of costs for the suppliers, who will presumably find technical means of enforcing licensing and payment constraints.

          There are very large high resolution tablet style screens used for graphics purposes which could probably support conductor's full scores - but I don't know if anyone uses those in that way.

          Re continuous displays - maybe those could be useful, but some degree of control would probably still be necessary. Images which move right to left are not always that easy to follow - and if there's a jump to the next section - that can be tricksy.

          Comment

          • Pulcinella
            Host
            • Feb 2014
            • 10941

            #6
            I wonder if the electronic versions are editable, so performers can put in bowing, breaths, etc (i.e., mark them up like you might a printed copy you were working from).

            Comment

            • Old Grumpy
              Full Member
              • Jan 2011
              • 3616

              #7
              Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
              We seem to have two threads on the go: this current one, and this:



              Can a host kindly merge them?
              LOL

              I think a host kindly unmerged the original thread at the specific request of the OP!

              Comment

              • EnemyoftheStoat
                Full Member
                • Nov 2010
                • 1132

                #8
                Originally posted by Old Grumpy View Post
                LOL

                I think a host kindly unmerged the original thread at the specific request of the OP!
                Can we get the Hokey-Kokey on an iPad?

                Comment

                • Old Grumpy
                  Full Member
                  • Jan 2011
                  • 3616

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
                  I wonder if the electronic versions are editable, so performers can put in bowing, breaths, etc (i.e., mark them up like you might a printed copy you were working from).
                  I have no direct personal experience of electronic scores, but from experience in an online choir where the director (host) uses one, yes, this is possible.

                  Comment

                  • Old Grumpy
                    Full Member
                    • Jan 2011
                    • 3616

                    #10
                    Originally posted by EnemyoftheStoat View Post
                    Can we get the Hokey-Kokey on an iPad?
                    Sounds like a jaunty number!

                    Comment

                    • mikealdren
                      Full Member
                      • Nov 2010
                      • 1200

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
                      I wonder if the electronic versions are editable, so performers can put in bowing, breaths, etc (i.e., mark them up like you might a printed copy you were working from).
                      Yes they are and younger musicians seem to be taking to them in droves. Markings can also be easily erased without degrading the parts. Sadly I have a problem with the small screens and aged eyes!

                      For orchestras, it does mean that the string sections can all have the same bowings and other markings direct from the front desk.

                      Finally, of course, large libraries of music can be stored on a small device.

                      Comment

                      • mikealdren
                        Full Member
                        • Nov 2010
                        • 1200

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
                        I wonder if the electronic versions are editable, so performers can put in bowing, breaths, etc (i.e., mark them up like you might a printed copy you were working from).
                        Sorry duplicate post

                        Comment

                        • Pulcinella
                          Host
                          • Feb 2014
                          • 10941

                          #13
                          Originally posted by mikealdren View Post
                          Yes they are and younger musicians seem to be taking to them in droves. Markings can also be easily erased without degrading the parts. Sadly I have a problem with the small screens and aged eyes!

                          For orchestras, it does mean that the string sections can all have the same bowings and other markings direct from the front desk.

                          Finally, of course, large libraries of music can be stored on a small device.
                          It might make an interesting future project if these markings get saved and identified with a particular conductor: this is the way we did it for X but Y wanted it like this.

                          Comment

                          • Old Grumpy
                            Full Member
                            • Jan 2011
                            • 3616

                            #14
                            Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
                            It might make an interesting future project if these markings get saved and identified with a particular conductor: this is the way we did it for X but Y wanted it like this.
                            I think the score has to be displayed through suitable software to do this. Presumably markings are made with a stylus or similar.

                            Comment

                            • pastoralguy
                              Full Member
                              • Nov 2010
                              • 7759

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
                              It might make an interesting future project if these markings get saved and identified with a particular conductor: this is the way we did it for X but Y wanted it like this.
                              Very often, conductors have their own sets of parts for certain works which are marked up to suit their particular interpretation. Sir Simon has his own sets of parts for Mahler symphonies I believe.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X