Iván Fischer at 70

[kernelbogey]

Iván Fischer at 70. Without knowing a great deal about Fischer I admire his music making - notably with his Budapest Festival Orchestra. I have to admit to confusing what he has done with his brother Adam - whose complete Beethoven Symphonies I own.

[smittims]

I think Ivan is the Haydn Symphony man. I was listening to the Nimbus /Brilliant Classics set this morning: lovely. And how fortunate to have so many fine recordings of these wonderful symphonies. Not so long ago Haydn was little known or understood by many.

[Petrushka]

It cant be that difficult to distinguish between Ivan and Adam!

It was Adam who recorded the Haydn symphonies; Ivan is chief conductor of the Budapest Festival Orchestra with many recordings (not Haydn, though) on Channel Classics and previously with Philips.

I wonder if anyone else caught the 'Hard Talk' programme on BBC several weeks ago in which Stephen Sackur interviewed Ivan. Probably gone from the i-player but might still be out there somewhere.

[Bryn]

It cant be that difficult to distinguish between Ivan and Adam!

It was Adam who recorded the Haydn symphonies; Ivan is chief conductor of the Budapest Festival Orchestra with many recordings (not Haydn, though) on Channel Classics and previously with Philips.

I wonder if anyone else caught the 'Hard Talk' programme on BBC several weeks ago in which Stephen Sackur interviewed Ivan. Probably gone from the i-player but might still be out there somewhere.

Still "available now": https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3ct1n74 via BBC Sounds, or, for the next 5 months, via https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...r-and-composer (with video) via the iPlayer.

[Petrushka]

Still "available now": https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3ct1n74 via BBC Sounds, or, for the next 5 months, via https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...r-and-composer (with video) via the iPlayer.

Thanks, Bryn. Worth watching!

[richardfinegold]

Both of the brothers are worth following. Ivan is best known to me for his recordings with the Budapest Festival Orchestra. They are about 80 players, so a bit small for a major Orchestra. I have several Bartok recordings they did with Phillips, and the PC disc with Kocsis is my favorite in that repertoire. For the past few decades they have been recording, in multichannel SACD, on Channel Classics, primarily Mahler/Brahms/Beethoven, with some Russian music sprinkled in. I admit that I have bought many of these for primarily for the audiophile credentials, but there hasn’t been a bad Apple in the lot, except for an indifferent Brahms First.
As noted Adam gained fame with his complete Haydn, on modern instruments. It was cheap as dirt, but frankly many of the performances sound as if they rolled off an assembly line. His Mahler from Düsseldorf garnered a lot of critical praise, far outpacing critical evaluation of Ivan’s cycle, although after I listened to the Fifth and Seventh by streaming I cannot see what the fuss was. Still Adam radiates a lot of enthusiasm on the YT clips that I have seen, so perhaps there is some gold there that I haven’t mined

[Bryn]

Both of the brothers are worth following. Ivan is best known to me for his recordings with the Budapest Festival Orchestra. They are about 80 players, so a bit small for a major Orchestra. I have several Bartok recordings they did with Phillips, and the PC disc with Kocsis is my favorite in that repertoire. For the past few decades they have been recording, in multichannel SACD, on Channel Classics, primarily Mahler/Brahms/Beethoven, with some Russian music sprinkled in. I admit that I have bought many of these for primarily for the audiophile credentials, but there hasn’t been a bad Apple in the lot, except for an indifferent Brahms First.
As noted Adam gained fame with his complete Haydn, on modern instruments. It was cheap as dirt, but frankly many of the performances sound as if they rolled off an assembly line. His Mahler from Düsseldorf garnered a lot of critical praise, far outpacing critical evaluation of Ivan’s cycle, although after I listened to the Fifth and Seventh by streaming I cannot see what the fuss was. Still Adam radiates a lot of enthusiasm on the YT clips that I have seen, so perhaps there is some gold there that I haven’t mined

That rather closely reflects my experience of their recordings, too.

[RichardB]

Iván's Mahler cycle is now complete except for no.8, is that right?

[Petrushka]

Iván's Mahler cycle is now complete except for no.8, is that right?

It is. My understanding is that Ivan Fischer does not intend recording the 8th, assuming he's not changed his mind.

[pastoralguy]

We’ve been lucky enough to see Ivan with the Budapest Festival Orchestra on many occasions at the Edinburgh Festival and they have always delivered top performances. For me, their recording of Dvorák 8 is absolutely glorious! Those string portamentis in the third movement are to die for.

[RichardB]

It is. My understanding is that Ivan Fischer does not intend recording the 8th, assuming he's not changed his mind.

I hope he does. I've been very impressed with his Mahler recordings. I didn't realise until today that he was so far on with his cycle. Now listening to the 7th which I hadn't heard before. Of which Hurwitz says "Honestly, I can’t recall a more unpleasant reading, one so clearly at odds with what the music is trying to express." As expected, so far it sounds wonderful.

[RichardB]

Further thoughts on Fischer's 7th: I was very taken with the recent Petrenko recording, which so to speak ticks all the boxes of what I desire from a recording of this work, but Fischer's ticks boxes I didn't know were there. By concentrating on precision and clarity, he invokes the emotional complexities of each movement to reveal something I hadn't suspected was there, even though this is a work I have always felt very closely involved in, and don't share the critical attitude towards it that many people seem to have. For example the second movement takes on a much stronger aspect of foreboding than I've come across before, not just looking back at morbid Romantic tropes like Heine's "Heimkehr" (a melancholic traveller observes a sentry going about his business in a tower, and ends with the line "I wish he'd shoot me dead") but somehow looking forward also and perceiving a shadow of twentieth century atrocities. Maybe I'm reading too much into it! - I generally tend not to go for overinterpretation of music, and these reflections come after listening rather than in the process, during which I suppose I was aware of something more disturbing than usual without being specific about what it might be. Still, I think this would be a performance to convince those for whom the 7th isn't on the same level as Mahler's other symphonies.

[smittims]

My apologies are due to both Maestri for confusing them. But I suppose they're used to it. Leo Black had to get used to explaining to people that he wasn't Leo Blech or Harry Blech; and aren't there two Misha Glenny's?.

[jayne lee wilson]

Further thoughts on Fischer's 7th: I was very taken with the recent Petrenko recording, which so to speak ticks all the boxes of what I desire from a recording of this work, but Fischer's ticks boxes I didn't know were there. By concentrating on precision and clarity, he invokes the emotional complexities of each movement to reveal something I hadn't suspected was there, even though this is a work I have always felt very closely involved in, and don't share the critical attitude towards it that many people seem to have. For example the second movement takes on a much stronger aspect of foreboding than I've come across before, not just looking back at morbid Romantic tropes like Heine's "Heimkehr" (a melancholic traveller observes a sentry going about his business in a tower, and ends with the line "I wish he'd shoot me dead") but somehow looking forward also and perceiving a shadow of twentieth century atrocities. Maybe I'm reading too much into it! - I generally tend not to go for overinterpretation of music, and these reflections come after listening rather than in the process, during which I suppose I was aware of something more disturbing than usual without being specific about what it might be. Still, I think this would be a performance to convince those for whom the 7th isn't on the same level as Mahler's other symphonies.

That's a very interesting reflection, Richard....

I loved the 7th as soon as I heard it, after buying the Solti LPs when I had only read about the work. I wasn't disappointed!

On the evocative level (which doesn't happen often with me, either, in the act of listening) I've usually associated the NightMusic 1 with nature; the 2nd movement reminds me of Simpson's comment on the Bruckner 6th scherzo "we are out in the night with Owls and Blown Leaves..." But there's some strange, at times tongue-in-cheek, dark humour in there too.
I recall a quote about the scherzo "it is a child's fear of the dark that Mahler so compassionately describes..." but I can't remember who wrote that.

The music is wonderfully suggestive in the poetical meaning of the word; there are many ways to play it. But the Symphony itself absolutely adds up into a cyclical unity for me - and very inspired one, melodically and on other levels...

[Bryn]

That's a very interesting reflection, Richard....

I loved the 7th as soon as I heard it, after buying the Solti LPs when I had only read about the work. I wasn't disappointed!

On the evocative level (which doesn't happen often with me, either, in the act of listening) I've usually associated the NightMusic 1 with nature; the 2nd movement reminds me of Simpson's comment on the Bruckner 6th scherzo "we are out in the night with Owls and Blown Leaves..." But there's some strange, at times tongue-in-cheek, dark humour in there too.
I recall a quote about the scherzo "it is a child's fear of the dark that Mahler so compassionately describes..." but I can't remember who wrote that.

The music is wonderfully suggestive in the poetical meaning of the word; there are many ways to play it. But the Symphony itself absolutely adds up into a cyclical unity for me - and very inspired one, melodically and on other levels...

The 7th was the first Mahler Symphony I really engaged with. I had heard the 1st and 4th but had not given them their due attention. I remember The Gramophone having a comparative review of the NYPO/Bernstein and USO/Abravanel recordings of the 7th. I was impecunious at the time so 'made do' with the Abravanel, despite a warning that there was a wrong timp note at the start of the scherzo. By the way, the word which I have always associated with that scherzo is phantasmagorical.