Debbie Wiseman talks utter guff about "classical music" on the Today programme.

[RichardB]

Not expecting a phone call, then, Richard?

From the BBC? Those days are over it seems.

[oddoneout]

Debbie Wiseman;... There are few people in the UK who have done as much to make classical music popular as Debbie ...

according to The Jewish Chronicle https://www.thejc.com/culture/music/...rology-1.53850
Time was her name seemed to crop up regularly in connection with music for Beeb TV programmes; perhaps the move to CFM stopped that.

ignorant people are wheeled out on R3 as if they were experts.

Worry not RichardB it was R4... but as FF says it would have been better to qualify her comments; she is not I think completely ignorant - opinionated and not enough challenged on her views perhaps? One of the risks of becoming "the go to person for classical music opinion", "popular", "ambassador for", etc etc - things are taken at face value since those listening lack the knowledge or inclination to question.

[RichardB]

Worry not RichardB it was R4...

Oh yes, sorry... still no excuse though.

[Bryn]

according to The Jewish Chronicle https://www.thejc.com/culture/music/...rology-1.53850
Time was her name seemed to crop up regularly in connection with music for Beeb TV programmes; perhaps the move to CFM stopped that.

Worry not RichardB it was R4... but as FF says it would have been better to qualify her comments; she is not I think completely ignorant - opinionated and not enough challenged on her views perhaps? One of the risks of becoming "the go to person for classical music opinion", "popular", "ambassador for", etc etc - things are taken at face value since those listening lack the knowledge or inclination to question.

What gets me is that she must have been fully aware that she was spouting nonsense. Thank goodness Sawney was there to contradict her.

[french frank]

What gets me is that she must have been fully aware that she was spouting nonsense.

I'm never surprised at other people's certainty that what they think and say is right - for which there are many explanations.

[cloughie]

The context of the piece was the controversy surrounding nominations for this year’s Grammy awards:

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2022/feb/20/how-is-this-classical-music-composers-fury-at-grammys-shortlist

The other interviewee in the Today programme, Nitin Sawhney, would not be drawn on providing a definition. So a lot of fuss about nothing really.

Just had a listen - based on hearing it I would say it is very much nearer to jazz than classical - in fact it is jazz not classical - but others may disagree!

https://youtu.be/6_AgCNq4djk

[Serial_Apologist]

I'm never surprised at other people's certainty that what they think and say is right - for which there are many explanations.

Indeed - and just to throw in some more dogma, Ms Wiseman cannot really be described as a classical composer, can she?

[RichardB]

Just had a listen - based on hearing it I would say it is very much nearer to jazz than classical - in fact it is jazz not classical

... as I said in #14

[french frank]

Indeed - and just to throw in some more dogma, Ms Wiseman cannot really be described as a classical composer, can she?

I couldn't possibly comment! Other than according to my own definition, which is almost certainly rubbish

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I couldn't possibly comment! Other than according to my own definition, which is almost certainly rubbish

She writes "chunes" for TV programmes, including Judge John Deed. An efficient and capable technical composer, who the Beeb obviously like to boost a very small number of composers/musicians etc, just as they've done with non-musicians, like the discredited Chris Woodhead (long after he'd been sacked as Ofsted boss), Tim Wetherspoon and Nigel Farage.

I didn't realise she was more popular than John Rutter, Bob Chilcott, Karl Jenkins and Howard Goodall.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Debbie Wiseman is a highly successful composer of film and tv music which draws on classical harmony and structures. Whether she is a composer of classical music in the sense that Thomas Ades or George Benjamin are is a moot point. I wonder whether she just used the written down vs improvised argument in haste without thinking it through . Improvisation is central to classical music - not least in composing. It’s good to see some classical recitalist reintroducing it . It’s obviously wrong to make this scored/improv distinction.
I was listening to Duke Ellington’s Daybreak Express just yesterday - a magnificent piece of sound painting of a steam (?) loco chugging along. It must have been largely scored (with the exception of the Cootie Williams solo) but it’s definitely jazz. As a piece of sound painting of a train it’s (imv) as good as similar pieces by Britten , Villa-Lobos , Honneger etc but to call it classical music doesn’t describe it accurately.
On the wider point record competitions run by the business are , with one or two honourable exceptions a complete joke aren’t they ?

[ahinton]

I didn't realise she was more popular than John Rutter, Bob Chilcott, Karl Jenkins and Howard Goodall.

Perhaps she didn't either.

I didn't hear the observations of someone who is clearly anything but a wise man but what I've read about them convinces me that my omission to do so was probably beneficial for my blood pressure if nothing else...

[RichardB]

competitions run by the business are , with one or two honourable exceptions a complete joke aren’t they ?

I completely agree, although I'm not sure there are any exceptions!

[Ein Heldenleben]

I completely agree, although I'm not sure there are any exceptions!

The “Classical” Brits used to get me so annoyed I had to stop watching it….there’s so little classical music on it…

[oddoneout]

The “Classical” Brits used to get me so annoyed I had to stop watching it….there’s so little classical music on it…

They were renamed (are they still going?) possibly to get round that slight difficulty - Classic BRIT Awards. Which sounds to me as if it ought to be an adjunct to the BRIT Awards.