Heterophony

[Joseph K]

If one could speak about having a 'favourite' texture (although I know the idea is a bit ridiculous) mine would be this. If people don't know what it is, here's the wiki page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterophony

I knew that this texture is quite rare in Western Classical music up until quite recently, so it was interesting to see examples of it in common practice music.

Here are some of my favourite examples:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3qYqmOD-qU

Starting at 1:14 here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3qYqmOD-qU

Throughout this, I think, but I especially like the section beginning at 6:13: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3etaMP9x9Y

Any other pieces people like that feature this texture? I think it tends to produce - in the examples I've given - and sort of hustle-and-bustle effect, very crunchy, although of course there are other musical aspects that create this. Then there are examples in Miles Davis's Bitches Brew, most notably the last five minutes of 'Pharaoh's Dance'. And of course Boulez. I'd say it features quite prominently, come to think of it, in music I like a lot.

[Richard Barrett]

Any other pieces people like that feature this texture?

A lot of Xenakis, Scelsi, Finnissy (especially in the 1980s), also as you say Miles especially in the electric period, and of course things like Ascension and Cecil's Winged Serpent for a similar large ensemble. Quite apart from its importance in almost every musical tradition around the world that one could name! (I wrote quite extensively on heterophony in my book.)

[Serial_Apologist]

Assuming I am understanding the term as laid down in Wiki, I have to say I couldn't be doing with its musical exemplification as per the Xenakis example all or even much of the time. On its own it seems to offer diminishing musical returns. Not to say that relentlessness is a necessary requirement, of course: in subventing goal expectations in the listener conditioned to narrative predictabilities in common with other non-narrative driven forms, the non-metric resolving character of this kind of music has consciousness centring potential. We're not talking symmetries or carefully worked out metric modulations here, so the spontaneous solo piano workouts typical of Keith Tippett and Cecil Taylor fall within the heterophonic category, I guess. By way of contrasts, fine: some passages remind me of the ending to Messiaen's Cantéyodjaya where something of the technique offers a dramatic culmination and discharge of previously tightly controlled energies, but also in the "total serial" sections in the work.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xXS00gzRP4

[Joseph K]

A lot of Xenakis, Scelsi, Finnissy (especially in the 1980s), also as you say Miles especially in the electric period, and of course things like Ascension and Cecil's Winged Serpent for a similar large ensemble. Quite apart from its importance in almost every musical tradition around the world that one could name! (I wrote quite extensively on heterophony in my book.)

Indeed you did write about heterophony in your book (you'll notice one of the examples I give above it from your Politeia). Come to think of it, I don't know much Finnissy from the 80s, so thanks for the tip.

[Richard Barrett]

I have to say I couldn't be doing with its musical exemplification as per the Xenakis example all or even much of the time. On its own it seems to offer diminishing musical returns.

Are you kidding, S_A? Surely it's one of the most original and powerful solo piano compositions of the 20th century!

edit: mind you the "performance" in JK's link is of a digital realisation, so maybe try this one instead https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAhxuM-O8Cs

[Richard Barrett]

Come to think of it, I don't know much Finnissy from the 80s, so thanks for the tip.

For example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPajdk_iijI

[Joseph K]

Assuming I am understanding the term as laid down in Wiki, I have to say I couldn't be doing with its musical exemplification as per the Xenakis example all or even much of the time. On its own it seems to offer diminishing musical returns. Not to say that relentlessness is a necessary requirement, of course: in subventing goal expectations in the listener conditioned to narrative predictabilities in common with other non-narrative driven forms, the non-metric resolving character of this kind of music has consciousness centring potential. We're not talking symmetries or carefully worked out metric modulations here, so the spontaneous solo piano workouts typical of Keith Tippett and Cecil Taylor fall within the heterophonic category, I guess. By way of contrasts, fine: some passages remind me of the ending to Messiaen's Cantéyodjaya where something of the technique offers a dramatic culmination and discharge of previously tightly controlled energies, but also in the "total serial" sections in the work.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xXS00gzRP4

Thanks for your response, SA. If I understand you correctly, you're saying it would be difficult to produce a long-ish piece or movement based solely on this technique (apropos your reservations about the Xenakis) - possibly, but the Messiaen and Barrett examples feature contrasting sections.

I am very fond, it has to be said, of much Gamelan and Gagaku music which is mainly based on heterophony.

[ahinton]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xXS00gzRP4

Video unavailable...

[Joseph K]

Are you kidding, S_A? Surely it's one of the most original and powerful solo piano compositions of the 20th century!

When I saw Jonathan Powell play the piece in Oxford along with all other pieces of Xenakis's piano oeuvre, it certainly was the stand-out piece for me!

[Joseph K]

edit: mind you the "performance" in JK's link is of a digital realisation, so maybe try this one instead https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAhxuM-O8Cs

Ah - sorry about that, I just grabbed one quickly and at the time did think it sounded a bit strange.

I've lined up the Finnissy for listening a bit later.

[Bryn]

When I saw Jonathan Powell play the piece in Oxford along with all other pieces of Xenakis's piano oeuvre, it certainly was the stand-out piece for me!

I wonder whether SA'a problem is with the synthetic realisation on Youtube, rather than the work? Xenakis was more than capable of composing for electronic media. Evryali, however, challenging as it is, was composed for a pianist to play.

[ahinton]

Ah - sorry about that, I just grabbed one quickly and at the time did think it sounded a bit strange.

Lukas Huisman and Jonathan Powell have each excelled in this piece; splendid Sorabji players as well, as it happens!...

[Serial_Apologist]

Video unavailable...

Apologies - my eyesight's playing up today. This is the one I meant:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xXSoogzRP4

[Joseph K]

I wonder whether SA'a problem is with the synthetic realisation on Youtube, rather than the work? Xenakis was more than capable of composing for electronic media. Evryali, however, challenging as it is, was composed for a pianist to play.

See #5.

[Serial_Apologist]

Are you kidding, S_A? Surely it's one of the most original and powerful solo piano compositions of the 20th century!

edit: mind you the "performance" in JK's link is of a digital realisation, so maybe try this one instead https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAhxuM-O8Cs

Thanks for the alternative link Richard. It could be down to my reading the score while hearing the work for the first time. This is no criticism of JK by the way, who would not have had any intention of this in his choice of link; it's all down to me!