Bernstein Mass

[Barbirollians]

In Gramophone this month’s Collection is Mass which Edward Seckerson plainly loves and regards as Bernstein’s most important piece .

I have subjected myself to it twice most recently when performed at the Proms . I cannot abide it - dated,embarrassing and cringeworthy sum it up to my ears .

What am I missing ?

[Bella Kemp]

I hate to denigrate something that so many people love - and it must be huge fun to perform - but it is pretty dreadful. I wonder if one must listen to it in the same way as one watches a Bollywood movie: enjoy it for the awful over-the-topness. Bernstein wrote some great music, but perhaps it might be hard to call any of it 'great' in the manner of Beethoven or Mahler, say - so Mr Seckerson isn't really saying much when he describes the Mass as Bernstein's most important piece. So to answer your question Barbirollians: dismantle your defences and just love it, but don't think too much about it.

[teamsaint]

I have to put a few preferences and preconceptions aside when I hear this piece.
And that is a good thing. It is a work unlike any other. It is bold in scope and nature, and sounds to me to be of its time, rather than dated.
My suspicion is that the lyrical content, religious and personal stripped of the potentially neutralising effect of a traditional liturgical context, is uncomfortable for many people.The combination of popular idiom and religious content hasn't always been comfortable, but that doesn't mean it isn't ever successful.Early U2 must be among the best examples of this by popular white musicians.
However, other than its eclectic nature, which is what it is, I enjoy the setting of the words as much as anything. I think this is expertly done, and it is full of rhythmical verve.

As to whether Bernstein wrote " great " music, well one test is longevity, and both this and many other works certainly pass that test, many decades on.

[Frances_iom]

It's of its time - basically brash, loud and poorly expressed tho I suspect the sentiments come from the heart - agree that much of it is cringeworthy rather like a 1960's circus is today.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I’m definitely ok with it, but Edward Seckerson is definitely putting his reputation on the line when he inflates it to become Bernstein’s “most important work”.

[Bryn]

I’m definitely ok with it, but Edward Seckerson is definitely putting his reputation on the line when he inflates it to become Bernstein’s “most important work”.

Quite. To describe it thus is to put a severe dent in Bernstein's reputation as a composer. That said, with the exception of the tunes he wrote for Sid Ramin to orchestrate for West Side Story, Bernstein's compositions are not really my bag.

[Pulcinella]

I'd probably take a Bernstein symphony (Age of Anxiety) to my desert island in preference to a Beethoven or Mahler one, but I too struggle with Mass. I have the Alsop and Bernstein versions (the Bernstein bought cheaply second-hand, partly because its coupling is Dybbuk, a favourite of brassbandmaestro; it too is not a work I get on with ).
As Bella suggests, it's probably great fun to be involved in.

Maybe I need to try again, following teamsaint's advice:

I have to put a few preferences and preconceptions aside when I hear this piece.

Off topic: do people know his Missa Brevis?
I don't, but have just tracked down Alsop's Naxos recording (the coupling to Kaddish) and will stream it later.

[Stanfordian]

In Gramophone this month’s Collection is Mass which Edward Seckerson plainly loves and regards as Bernstein’s most important piece .

I have subjected myself to it twice most recently when performed at the Proms . I cannot abide it - dated,embarrassing and cringeworthy sum it up to my ears .

What am I missing ?

I have to say Bernstein's 'Mass' doesn't do much for me! His 'West Side Story' was highly influential for a generation and it's still persuasive to many today.''

[Serial_Apologist]

I have to say Bernstein's 'Mass' doesn't do much for me! His 'West Side Story' was highly influential for a generation and it's still persuasive to many today.''

Some who disparage the Mass are OK with the Chichester Psalms. I have to say, I find both to be garish and banal, whereas West Side Story yielded some fine songs, some of which have served well as jazz standards. We "did" West Side Story in my penultimate year at school: I was put in charge of the off-stage choir, which may have something to do with my affection for the musical as well as its message, particularly in view of the fact that for the first time in living memory it supplanted the annual 'O' level syllabus Shakespeare; and we all had to wear black polo neck sweaters so as to be as near to invisible as possible, which from a Mod fashion pov was pretty in 1963.

[Cockney Sparrow]

Some who disparage the Mass are OK with the Chichester Psalms. I have to say, I find both to be garish and banal, .........

Chichester Psalms hold their place in the repertory. Nightmare to rehearse - it would be OK if there was a guarantee there would be no Hebrew speakers in the audience. Has to be extra private study and phonetic repetition to get anywhere near the correct pronuniciation.

[Keraulophone]

Chichester Psalms ... it would be OK if there was a guarantee there would be no Hebrew speakers in the audience. Has to be extra private study and phonetic repetition to get anywhere near the correct pronuniciation.

One can get away with a reasonable approximation to the correct pronunciation in the fast bits!