Unheard British symphonies

[Serial_Apologist]

Sometime around 1970 the BBC undertook to broadcast all of the Brian symphonies that had not been aired before. They had started broadcasting Brian with Symphony No.8, the first Brian symphony to be performed, in 1954. The Gothic was broadcast in 1966 and several other symphonies had been broadcast before they decided to do them all. The "cycle" was indeed completed in a series of concerts at irregular intervals, the final ones being Nos.27, 29, 31 and 32 in two concerts in March 1979.

Thanks for that, Lion-of-Vienna.

It might be a bit much to ask, but something I've long wondered about is that at least one re-numbering of the Brian symphonies has clearly taken place, as I am unable to align the recordings of the ones I have with the numberings where mentioned in the Simpson-edited Penguin edition "The Symphony - Vol 2" which I have. The problem seems to come around the time of the "Tragic", which I assume to have been un-numbered, originally, and seems to have put the others out of sequence?

[Pulcinella]

Thanks for that, Lion-of-Vienna.

It might be a bit much to ask, but something I've long wondered about is that at least one re-numbering of the Brian symphonies has clearly taken place, as I am unable to align the recordings of the ones I have with the numberings where mentioned in the Simpson-edited Penguin edition "The Symphony - Vol 2" which I have. The problem seems to come around the time of the "Tragic", which I assume to have been un-numbered, originally, and seems to have put the others out of sequence?

Maybe the list of dates and keys in this Wiki article will help:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Havergal_Brian#Symphonies

PS: Nice to be reminded of the Pelican series: I have Chamber Music, The Concerto, and the two volumes of The Symphony, too. Just dug vol 2 out to read the chapter on Brian!

[Serial_Apologist]

Maybe the list of dates and keys in this Wiki article will help:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Have...ian#Symphonies

Thanks, Pulcers.

[Pulcinella]

Thanks, Pulcers.

S_A: Are you sure that The Tragic is the 'problem'?
In the Pelican chapter, Truscott says (p141 in my copy):
His Second Symphony, the 'Gothic'.....
but then on p142 he says:
It is true that the 'Gothic', which now stands as Brian's first symphony since the actual first was broken up (the two pieces Festal Dance and Fantastic Variations on an Old Rhyme are all that is left of it)......

[LMcD]

Very good recording of the Sinfonietta and Overture for a masque on Lyrita - LPO Boult, coupled with the Symphony NPO Boult.

The Naxos recording of the Symphony also includes the Sinfonietta.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

"I'm not going to die! I've just bought a new pair of trousers!"

- quite right, too!

[Edgy 2]

British music is the bread and butter of my home listening.
Not sure why more British Symphonies aren't programmed in the concert hall but surely the BBC could devote an hour or two every week to broadcasting recordings.

I though we already had a thread on British Symphonists but I cant find it,maybe I dreamt it.
Time for my regular 'I'd sooner listen to a George LLoyd Symphony than a Sibelius one' line for which I have been accused on here in the past of having iffy musical taste.

How about a top 20 of favourite rarely heard,if ever,British Symphonies

Malcolm Arnold 9
Stanley Bate 3
George Dyson in G
George Lloyd 4
Gordon Jacob 2
Ruth Gipps 4
Alan Rawsthorne 2
Edmund Rubbra 4
Edwin York Bowen 2
William Alwyn 1 to 4 (little cheat but in effect one big Symphony)
Arnold Bax 2
Charles Villiers Stanford 5
Hubert Parry 5
Lennox Berkley 2
Grace Williams 2
William Wordsworth 3
David Matthews 6
William Matthias 1
John Blackwodd McEwen Solway
Kenneth Leighton 2

20 isn't enough

and fill yer boots with this little lot http://www.musicweb-international.co...symphonies.htm

[Lion-of-Vienna]

The Havergal Brian symphony numbering system is fairly straightforward (I think). The first symphony that he wrote, in 1907, was called Fantastic Symphony. Brian for many years called this No.1, even after he had dismantled it, preserving only the outer movements (as Pulcinella has said).The Gothic, written in the 1920s became No.2 and the next four works became Nos.3 to 6. In 1948 he wrote Sinfonia Tragica but did not give it a number since he regarded it as the prelude to a proposed opera based on Synge's play Deidre of the Sorrows. The opera never materialised due to copyright reasons. Brian continued writing symphonies numbered from No.7 onwards until, in 1967, he decided on a renumbering. The Fantastic Symphony, which by then no longer existed, was take out of the canon. Symphonies 2 to 6 became Nos.1 to 5 and Sinfonia Tragica slotted in as No.6. The remaining symphonies were unchanged. Simple isn't it?

[Edgy 2]

... yep. I have decided life is too short to spend time on British orchestral music.

.

[Stanfordian]

I'd love to hear Fritz Hart's Symphony (1934). I wouldn't be surprised that it hasn't been professionally played if at all.

Born in London, Hart went to the Royal College of Music - friends with Gustav Holst, Samuel Coleridge-Taylor, William Hurlstone, Ralph Vaughan Williams, John Ireland et al. Spent most of his adult life in Australia then moved to Hawaii where he died.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Maybe the list of dates and keys in this Wiki article will help:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Havergal_Brian#Symphonies

PS: Nice to be reminded of the Pelican series: I have Chamber Music, The Concerto, and the two volumes of The Symphony, too. Just dug vol 2 out to read the chapter on Brian!

Have those four vols , in their way , ever been bettered ? Find myself re reading them every three years or so..

[Maclintick]

Symphonies 2 to 6 became Nos.1 to 5 and Sinfonia Tragica slotted in as No.6.

The Sinfonia Tragica is one I've always loved since the première recording ( AFAIK ) on Lyrita by the LPO under Myer Fredman, who relocated to Adelaide in the 1980s, as I recall. Martyn Brabbins & the BBCSO recently included it in a concert broadcast 2 years ago, if memory serves.

[Maclintick]

Have those four vols , in their way , ever been bettered ? Find myself re reading them every three years or so..

A formative ingredient in my musical education, along with Jack Westrup's Master Musicians
series. Truscott's chapters on Havergal Brian centre on formal aspects -- & there's no doubting that this composer's devotion to formal balance is his prime consideration -- but I often feel his thematic inspiration lags his compositional accueil .....i.e. what he does with his ideas exceeds their distinction..does this make sense ?

[ahinton]

a top 20 of favourite rarely heard,if ever,British Symphonies

Malcolm Arnold 9
Stanley Bate 3
George Dyson in G
George Lloyd 4
Gordon Jacob 2
Ruth Gipps 4
Alan Rawsthorne 2
Edmund Rubbra 4
Edwin York Bowen 2
William Alwyn 1 to 4 (little cheat but in effect one big Symphony)
Arnold Bax 2
Charles Villiers Stanford 5
Hubert Parry 5
Lennox Berkley 2
Grace Williams 2
William Wordsworth 3
David Matthews 6
William Matthias 1
John Blackwodd McEwen Solway
Kenneth Leighton 2

Of these, the only living composer is David Matthews who now has nine symphonies to his credit of which the Sixth (whose Proms première I attended) is to my mind the finest.

[jayne lee wilson]

Probably not much point my reiterating enthusiasm for the David Matthews Symphonies yet again....
(But.... try 4,5,7 and 9 as "entry points", rather than the epic 6th..... 8th remains unrecorded...)...

But what about Maxwell Davies?
Not much played now, his 10 Symphonies must be by far the most original such creations post-war....7 and 8 still lack recordings...

Scarcely surprising given their complexity and "difficulty"..(often based on medieval chants and plainsong, flowing and densely contrapuntal).. but so very rewarding to return to...