Radio 3 sheds fuddy-duddy image

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  • jayne lee wilson
    Banned
    • Jul 2011
    • 10711

    #31
    Well, I still wonder what those who hate it now would do to promote a present-day Radio 3, as an intelligent, all-around, artistically, culturally and musical aware station. The problem with concentrating on Classical Music almost exclusively is that it is now in serious competition with high-quality streaming services, Berlin DCH, Medici tv etc etc....

    So I think you have to try to promote it somehow - catchily, why not...?
    ("Passionate Minds" has a ring and a resonance to it for me; "Thoughtful introverts" really does sound like a satirical comedy creation...

    Growing up with Radio 3 in the 70s, programmes like Critics Forum, Six Continents, the amazing Radio plays often created by poets like Ted Hughes and Peter Redgrove... were just as important to me as the music. And New Music "Music in Our Time", which often went out on a weekday afternoon, was also a big part of that too. How many here listen to the Proms Premieres?

    So the editing of the station will always be a problem of choices, even though most of us can agree about the poor quality of presentation on the TV Proms, for example, or the superfluous shallowness of tweets, instant comments and fragmentary programming....

    There's still much good musical programming available from afternoon and evening concerts (and accessible more or less anytime you want); but the competition of such from elsewhere has put a potentially high-quality public service under lot of pressure...

    Whoa! Gotta rescue the Guardian and the Gramophone from the thunder quick....

    Comment

    • Pulcinella
      Host
      • Feb 2014
      • 10965

      #32
      Jayne

      Surely a start would be simply to play the music and let it speak for itself?
      Oh, and some useful information about the piece might help: even when full-length pieces are played, we all too rarely get told how many movements there are, for example.

      Comment

      • jayne lee wilson
        Banned
        • Jul 2011
        • 10711

        #33
        Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
        Jayne

        Surely a start would be simply to play the music and let it speak for itself?
        Oh, and some useful information about the piece might help: even when full-length pieces are played, we all too rarely get told how many movements there are, for example.
        Sure, point taken, but such things can be quickly found via smartphone or tablet now...via wiki and elsewhere... I tend to research Proms Programmes on the laptop if I have the time beforehand...sometimes I go look at album inlays on Amazon/Qobuz etc if I don't know the layout of a piece & can't find much on it...

        I guess it just became the way I do it...

        But I'm very bad at paying attention to the live intros & often miss info on there, or running around after Cats or getting a drink...so.... whatever it takes..!
        Last edited by jayne lee wilson; 25-07-19, 15:24.

        Comment

        • LezLee
          Full Member
          • Apr 2019
          • 634

          #34
          Originally posted by jayne lee wilson View Post
          Sure, point taken, but such things can be quickly found via smartphone or tablet now...via wiki and elsewhere... I tend to research Proms Programmes on the laptop if I have the time beforehand...sometimes I go look at album inlays on Amazon/Qobuz etc if I don't know the layout of a piece & can't find much on it...

          I guess it just became the way I do it...

          But I'm very bad at paying attention to the live intros & often miss info on there, or running around after Cats or getting a drink...so.... whatever it takes..!
          10% of the British population do not have internet access. My sister doesn't have a smartphone or a tablet and keeps her computer upstairs where she checks her emails about twice a week.

          Comment

          • MrGongGong
            Full Member
            • Nov 2010
            • 18357

            #35
            Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
            Oh, and some useful information about the piece might help: even when full-length pieces are played, we all too rarely get told how many movements there are, for example.
            Time to dust this off methinks

            Comment

            • oddoneout
              Full Member
              • Nov 2015
              • 9218

              #36
              Originally posted by jayne lee wilson View Post
              Sure, point taken, but such things can be quickly found via smartphone or tablet now...via wiki and elsewhere... I tend to research Proms Programmes on the laptop if I have the time beforehand...sometimes I go look at album inlays on Amazon/Qobuz etc if I don't know the layout of a piece & can't find much on it...

              I guess it just became the way I do it...

              But I'm very bad at paying attention to the live intros & often miss info on there, or running around after Cats or getting a drink...so.... whatever it takes..!
              This kind of thing was a large part of the reason for my comment about why would that target group listen to R3. They will be used to using online resources for their information and entertainment, so a radio station is hardly likely to be a significant alternative if they don't already listen.
              I can't see that there is much of a future for R3 in the long term - or possibly even in the medium term considering how increasingly inimical the political climate is to the arts - so I cannot see the point of faffing around trying to lure some section of the population which does not currently listen. Better to focus on producing good quality programmes for the audience they currently have - rather than driving it away. There is no reason why such programmes should not cover or have regard to topical issues, but for heavens sake let's have a bit of intelligence about it, rather than eg shoehorning 'classical music' into yoof culture(or vice versa) and putting out the result on a platform the said yoof don't access.

              Comment

              • Richard Tarleton

                #37
                Originally posted by jayne lee wilson View Post

                ("Passionate Minds" has a ring and a resonance to it for me; "Thoughtful introverts" really does sound like a satirical comedy creation...
                Well it was meant as a joke to hint at what I regard as the silliness of the opposite.... but why does it sound funny to you, when it could apply to up to half of the R3 listenership, actual or potential? As a thoughtful introvert myself I'm quite offended by the thought that it sounds like a satirical comedy creation to you (when Passionate Minds, which comes straight from WIA, apparently doesn't), and I feel quite excluded by the thought that R3 values passionate extroverts [their word] who like doing things in groups more highly than they value me. It suggests to me that it wasn't a serious enquiry at all, but was dreamt up to describe the sort of people SK, KD and CB-H feel comfortable broadcasting to. The one time I did a Myers-Briggs test, on a management course and under the supervision of a qualified psychologist, I came out quite emphatically as "Introverted Thinking Judgmental" in terms of my preferences, so clearly R3 wants nothing to do with me.

                Curiously enough the focus group exercise I mentioned earlier came up with a category called "Curious minds". Backed up by several pages of research it wasn't describing quite the demographic that the Beeb's term does - but extroverts and introverts could feel equally happy about having it applied to them.

                So the editing of the station will always be a problem of choices, even though most of us can agree about the poor quality of presentation on the TV Proms, for example, or the superfluous shallowness of tweets, instant comments and fragmentary programming....
                Indeed - and it's clear from this that R3 and BBC2/4 are making a remarkable number of wrong choices.

                Comment

                • DracoM
                  Host
                  • Mar 2007
                  • 12977

                  #38
                  W1A is exactly what this is!!!

                  Comment

                  • Pulcinella
                    Host
                    • Feb 2014
                    • 10965

                    #39
                    Originally posted by MrGongGong View Post
                    I'm glad that that was in translation: I would have struggled even more in the original.


                    And why is the number of movements in a piece of music that sort of fact?
                    You've lost me, I'm afraid, just like Radio 3 has lost me as a listener.

                    Comment

                    • Kernow Malc
                      Full Member
                      • Oct 2018
                      • 56

                      #40
                      The use of focus groups in politics has lead to bland, substance-less policy making, where the product (note the word 'product' this is the work of advertising types) is glossy, full of short repetitive sound bites and trendy words and is, of course, irritating as ****. Sound familiar?

                      Comment

                      • jayne lee wilson
                        Banned
                        • Jul 2011
                        • 10711

                        #41
                        Originally posted by Richard Tarleton View Post
                        Well it was meant as a joke to hint at what I regard as the silliness of the opposite.... but why does it sound funny to you, when it could apply to up to half of the R3 listenership, actual or potential? As a thoughtful introvert myself I'm quite offended by the thought that it sounds like a satirical comedy creation to you (when Passionate Minds, which comes straight from WIA, apparently doesn't), and I feel quite excluded by the thought that R3 values passionate extroverts [their word] who like doing things in groups more highly than they value me. It suggests to me that it wasn't a serious enquiry at all, but was dreamt up to describe the sort of people SK, KD and CB-H feel comfortable broadcasting to. The one time I did a Myers-Briggs test, on a management course and under the supervision of a qualified psychologist, I came out quite emphatically as "Introverted Thinking Judgmental" in terms of my preferences, so clearly R3 wants nothing to do with me.

                        Curiously enough the focus group exercise I mentioned earlier came up with a category called "Curious minds". Backed up by several pages of research it wasn't describing quite the demographic that the Beeb's term does - but extroverts and introverts could feel equally happy about having it applied to them.



                        Indeed - and it's clear from this that R3 and BBC2/4 are making a remarkable number of wrong choices.
                        OK Richard, wires crossed a little here.... I could easily & happily describe myself as "thoughtfully introverted" too....(well some of the time....cyclothymia has its drawbacks and switchbacks...I'm never quite sure how to describe myself or define myself really (is anyone?)..too many lows and highs (well more of the former) & not enough middle....)

                        A passionate mind often gets no rest at all!

                        But I was commenting on the "introverted" phrase as if it were to be used as a promotional label...

                        ....there's a certain Steve "Interesting" Davis tone to it in the context.... sorry but catchphrases need to be....catchy...but sometimes a phrase only works ​when someone sends it up.... (remember what Davis did with it? Excellent...)

                        Oddly enough, I'm finding a lot more to program in on BBC4 and BBC2 recently...science politics culture music..... so there you go.

                        OK Proms Premiere time!
                        Last edited by jayne lee wilson; 25-07-19, 18:21.

                        Comment

                        • Richard Tarleton

                          #42


                          I think you may have identified the problem here, Jayne - the focus group exercise I have been referring to was for internal consumption - to better enable the organisation to understand its audience and supporters. To the best of my knowledge it wasn't publicised. Whereas the R3 exercise seems to be largely concerned with the Beeb describing the audience it thinks it would like to have, to said audience - it's aspirational, as opposed to analytical. And it doesn't aspire to have me amongst its continuing support group

                          Comment

                          • Edgy 2
                            Guest
                            • Jan 2019
                            • 2035

                            #43
                            Originally posted by Sir Velo View Post
                            Far Kinelle, I think...
                            Yep,without the far,quiet KI followed by a loud NELLE,probably sounds better than it looks
                            “Music is the best means we have of digesting time." — Igor Stravinsky

                            Comment

                            • MickyD
                              Full Member
                              • Nov 2010
                              • 4778

                              #44
                              How wearisome all this 'target group' nonsense is.

                              It is not just confined to Radio 3 - of late I have been dismayed to see the Facebook page of my beloved Academy of Ancient Music going down the same road, with silly caption contests and a photo of a harpsichord Photoshopped in fluorescent colours.

                              If going back to tried and trusted old methods are considered "fuddy-duddy", then I am quite happy to associate myself with that.

                              Comment

                              • Bryn
                                Banned
                                • Mar 2007
                                • 24688

                                #45
                                The real thing is about to start on London Live.
                                Last edited by Bryn; 26-07-19, 09:41. Reason: Typo

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