New Music Genres : 1945-1981 versus 1981-2017

[Lat-Literal]

I would like to suggest that there were 10 times more new music genres in the 36 year period 1945-1981 than there were in the 36 year period 1981-2017.

Why, if true, should this have been the case?

[Quarky]

I'm sure you will get many erudite posts on this. However 1945 marked the end of WWII, with huge social changes world-wide, and a world-wide relaxation into non-belligerent activities.

[MrGongGong]

Sorry about this
BUT

You have to say what you mean by "New Music"
and "Genres"

and WHERE ?

[Lat-Literal]

Sorry about this
BUT

You have to say what you mean by "New Music"
and "Genres"

and WHERE ?

Between 1945 and 1981, there were probably at least half a dozen new jazz categories plus the new folk revival, celtic revival, the main beginnings of world music, updated country and western, new country, calypso, ska, various categories of reggae, rock n roll, the blues revival, R and B, garage, Merseybeat, psychedelia, heavy rock, prog rock, FM rock and umpteen other forms of rock, AOR, "the singer-songwriter", pop, soul, funk, disco, electronica, punk, new wave, the new romantics, indie, avant-garde and even rap and hip-hop are from 1979.

That's just off the top of my head - and I could easily further sub-divide many of them.

Soul, for example, and electronica.

There is nothing like this list for 1981-2017.

And it could be argued that classical music should be performing better because of the comparative hiatus.

[Braunschlag]

Not so sure about that.
Death metal, thrash, speedcore, hip house, glam metal, electro-clash, ghetto tech, hair metal, G Funk, Britpop, bubblegum pop, indie rock, nu metal, mortuary metal and so on. Agreed there’s a deal of sub division but I find the number of new styles now totally bewildering.

[Lat-Literal]

Not so sure about that.
Death metal, thrash, speedcore, hip house, glam metal, electro-clash, ghetto tech, hair metal, G Funk, Britpop, bubblegum pop, indie rock, nu metal, mortuary metal and so on. Agreed there’s a deal of sub division but I find the number of new styles now totally bewildering.

Hair metal?

Well, yes, although I would argue that bubblegum pop and indie rock pre date 1982. I could add to your list blue eyed soul, acid house and all other variations of house, shoegazing, grunge, the new so-called rhythm and blues, grime, grimecore and no doubt more. But with some exceptions, many of which you and I have listed, surely this is not the same thing.

The main colours are often weaker - and the shades indistinct. I am about to have Wellbeing on my bedroom wall and I have Mint Macaroon in my kitchen. It's like that. You would not have guessed that they are green and blue respectively. Mint actually suggests green. Between 1945 and 1981 everything new was an identifiable colour or an identifiable shade, ie real.

[Richard Barrett]

And it could be argued that classical music should be performing better because of the comparative hiatus.

Classical music should be "performing better" (which means what?) because genres in popular music are not multiplying as fast as they were in past times? What is the connection there? Otherwise, the period 1945-80, in the West at least, was one in which advances in social democracy were reflected in a culture characterised more by optimism and outgoingness than in either the previous period or in the succeeding one which began with the "empire striking back" in the shape of the Reagan/Thatcher years. If you stifle society, you stifle the creative voices of society too.

[teamsaint]

Hair metal?

Well, yes, although I would argue that bubblegum pop and indie rock pre date 1982. I could add to your list blue eyed soul, acid house and all other variations of house, shoegazing, grunge, the new so-called rhythm and blues, grime, grimecore and no doubt more. But with some exceptions, many of which you and I have listed, surely this is not the same thing.

The main colours are often weaker - and the shades indistinct. I am about to have Wellbeing on my bedroom wall and I have Mint Macaroon in my kitchen. It's like that. You would not have guessed that they are green and blue respectively. Mint actually suggests green. Between 1945 and 1981 everything new was an identifiable colour or an identifiable shade, ie real.

Not sure I am quite with you here, Lat.
But I just bought the dulux version of “ the Who Live at Leeds”.


( metal sub genres are almost endless. I once saw five, thats FIVE metal bands at the NEC Arena, including Dragonforce, ( sort of Glam Metal), Trivium, and Machine Head....)

[Lat-Literal]

Classical music should be "performing better" (which means what?) because genres in popular music are not multiplying as fast as they were in past times? What is the connection there? Otherwise, the period 1945-80, in the West at least, was one in which advances in social democracy were reflected in a culture characterised more by optimism and outgoingness than in either the previous period or in the succeeding one which began with the "empire striking back" in the shape of the Reagan/Thatcher years. If you stifle society, you stifle the creative voices of society too.

I'm sure you will get many erudite posts on this. However 1945 marked the end of WWII, with huge social changes world-wide, and a world-wide relaxation into non-belligerent activities.

Yes, I agree with your main points which are interesting.

I meant performing better in terms of broadening audiences with the idea that there is something of a creative vacuum elsewhere.

Not sure I am quite with you here, Lat.
But I just bought the dulux version of “ the Who Live at Leeds”.

( metal sub genres are almost endless. I once saw five, thats FIVE metal bands at the NEC Arena, including Dragonforce, ( sort of Glam Metal), Trivium, and Machine Head....)

But the metal tag of itself is in origins easily within the first period.

I am quite prepared to accept that I am simply out of touch if I can be made to believe it.

But it just seems to me that real new genres are fewer, transitory and more manufactured.

[MrGongGong]

There is nothing like this list for 1981-2017.

Nothing?
Where ?

Maybe people are doing things in places you are not aware of ?

you are also making massive assumptions about the way music happens in the world which is much wider than we often imagine

[Lat-Literal]

Nothing?
Where ?

Maybe people are doing things in places you are not aware of ?

you are also making massive assumptions about the way music happens in the world which is much wider than we often imagine

Doesn't the international dimension reinforce the going back and often very much further?

Appalachian, cajun, zydeco, nuevo cancion, bossa nova, mbalax, township jazz, afrobeat, qawallis, ragas etc etc etc. etc.

Most of the new world is being hip-hoppified (Sugarhill Gang, '79) and auto-tuned or similar (Frampton Comes Alive, '76).

(If not Frampton, Sparky's Magic Piano, 1947-8)

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I just bought the dulux version of “ the Who Live at Leeds”.

I think we should gloss over that.

[Lat-Literal]

I think we should gloss over that.

[LMcD]

Is there a cover version? Did Matt Monro record it? Or Basil Brush (with the help of Rodney Bewes and-or Derek Fowlds, of course)?

[Richard Barrett]

Maybe people are doing things in places you are not aware of ?

you are also making massive assumptions about the way music happens in the world which is much wider than we often imagine

The idea of "multiplying genres" as some kind of measure of the vitality of a music scene is in any case questionable. Genres in popular music are first and foremost marketing strategies. It may be that, with the increased accessibility of any and all musics in the present century, along with the decline of the music industry as such, what people are doing now isn't so easy to categorise and there isn't so much commercial potential in doing so. I would accept that these days there's a relative lack of diversity not only in commercial music but also in the "official" version of non-commercial music (Proms programming etc.), but from what I experience this doesn't necessarily reflect a lack of diversity in what people are actually doing.