BBC4 TV - Sgt Pepper's Musical Revolution with Howard Goodall

[Lat-Literal]

Should anyone have ever doubted..............

Immense:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08tb97f

(In contrast, 21st Century "progress" has set us back years)

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Howard Goodall's analysis was fascinating.

[Lat-Literal]

Howard Goodall's analysis was fascinating.

Yes it was.

I thought it was a very good programme which showed just how much went into it.

[Serial_Apologist]

"Rock Goes to Collage"

[cloughie]

Howard Goodall's analysis was fascinating.

I think it was very interesting and whilst not agreeing with all his analysis I think it also demonstrated yet again, the important role of George Martin in pulling together a combination of the free rein and ideas of the individual Beatles' talents and adding his own inventive use of the recording studio, which 50 years ago were less well equipped than today.

[Lat-Literal]

I think it was very interesting and whilst not agreeing with all his analysis I think it also demonstrated yet again, the important role of George Martin in pulling together a combination of the free rein and ideas of the individual Beatles' talents and adding his own inventive use of the recording studio, which 50 years ago were less well equipped than today.

Yes, absolutely. We didn't have many toys then so we had to use her imaginations. I say this wholly without irony. There would not have been a Phil Spector or a Joe Meek in this day and age either. Goodall, who I like, has occasionally stretched the classical and popular music links a little too far but here he convinced and it was utterly compelling. I also enjoyed the explanation of the transposing, if slowing down of, Little Richard; the detailed analysis of George's interpretation of Indian music - a hybrid; Paul's art film tours - more extensive than I had realized; and especially the folk classicism underpinning "She's Leaving Home" along with the highlighting of its multi-directional narrative. Personally, I would have included "Strawberry Fields Forever" and "Penny Lane" on the album and ditched a couple of the tracks - it was very good that he included those given that they were a part of the sessions.

As a social document indicating both place and time, it could hardly be much better.....it is so spot on and the generational edginess which is accentuated in the "Magical Mystery Tour" film which followed it is rare in that it revolves around a debate about experimentation rather than conflict per se. It just pre-empts the time when the new expression suddenly looked like it would be permanent so the blunt/bludgeoning thing that is fury is absent. What there is instead is a assumed temporary shifting about in the seat which is razor edged.

[johncorrigan]

Personally, I would have included "Strawberry Fields Forever" and "Penny Lane" on the album and ditched a couple of the tracks - it was very good that he included those given that they were a part of the sessions.

Interesting, Lat, but I just don't know what you would drop. There was a limit to what could be contained on a single LP. I imagined it being about 45 minutes. Sgt Pepper is just shy of 40 so they could have included one of Strawberry Fields or Penny Lane, I suppose.(which one?) But they released those as a double 'A' side single because nothing had appeared from the Fab Four for ages and, in general, the Beatles had shied away from releasing singles from LPs. I think it stands beautifully as it is...maybe it could have been better...we will never know, in the way that we will never know what would have happened if 'Smile' had been released complete with 'Heroes and Villains', 'Good Vibrations' and 'Surf's Up' and their accompanying songs, when it had originally been intended, and not in bits and pieces in the following years. I often wonder about it.

I think Sgt P exists as an entity. I find it difficult to listen to individual songs...I want the whole or nothing at all, all tracks running into each other, all with the exhibition of these two musical geniuses supported by the superb and varied drumming of Ringo, and that wonderful producer - I'm not dismissing George H, but other than the glorious 'Within You, Without You' he is a bit player on the record...he comes out of his shell after this!

I didn't agree with all of Howard Goodall's input but I found it fascinating nonetheless...sometimes he wants to tell us TOO much. But it's still, over 50 years on, one of my favourite records. Lennon and McCartney...pretty marvellous actually as far as I'm concerned.

[gradus]

Strawberry Fields brings to mind the amusing memory of Hans Keller wearing a pair of headphones and analysing the piece to camera so that we could understand how all that rhythmic shifting around worked.

[cloughie]

Yes, absolutely. We didn't have many toys then so we had to use her imaginations. I say this wholly without irony. There would not have been a Phil Spector or a Joe Meek in this day and age either.

I was watching James Martin's Saturday Morning - one of his guests was Jack Savoretti. He remarked on something which I think the Pop side of things has been a problem for years. He mentioned that he did not get on well with the music industry early on because he didn't want to be told what to do. How much talent is stifled by some producer or manager knowing what's best? The good ones encourage and enhance what's there.

[cloughie]

Interesting, Lat, but I just don't know what you would drop. There was a limit to what could be contained on a single LP. I imagined it being about 45 minutes. Sgt Pepper is just shy of 40 so they could have included one of Strawberry Fields or Penny Lane, I suppose.(which one?) But they released those as a double 'A' side single because nothing had appeared from the Fab Four for ages and, in general, the Beatles had shied away from releasing singles from LPs. I think it stands beautifully as it is...maybe it could have been better...we will never know, in the way that we will never know what would have happened if 'Smile' had been released complete with 'Heroes and Villains', 'Good Vibrations' and 'Surf's Up' and their accompanying songs, when it had originally been intended, and not in bits and pieces in the following years. I often wonder about it.

I think Sgt P exists as an entity. I find it difficult to listen to individual songs...I want the whole or nothing at all, all tracks running into each other, all with the exhibition of these two musical geniuses supported by the superb and varied drumming of Ringo, and that wonderful producer - I'm not dismissing George H, but other than the glorious 'Within You, Without You' he is a bit player on the record...he comes out of his shell after this!

I didn't agree with all of Howard Goodall's input but I found it fascinating nonetheless...sometimes he wants to tell us TOO much. But it's still, over 50 years on, one of my favourite records. Lennon and McCartney...pretty marvellous actually as far as I'm concerned.

jc, yes Sgt Pepper as an entity is right as we know it now. As add ons the inclusion of Strawberry Fields and Penny Lane would not have been a problem lengthwise - many classical ones at the time exceeded an hour and the Stones' Aftermath was 54 mins. I would have put SF at the end of side 1 and Penny Lane to start Side 2. My other suggestion would have been unfair to Ringo and George and that would be replacing With a little help.. with PL and Within you... with SF. I might try those as playlists to see how they work!

[Lat-Literal]

Interesting, Lat, but I just don't know what you would drop. There was a limit to what could be contained on a single LP. I imagined it being about 45 minutes. Sgt Pepper is just shy of 40 so they could have included one of Strawberry Fields or Penny Lane, I suppose.(which one?) But they released those as a double 'A' side single because nothing had appeared from the Fab Four for ages and, in general, the Beatles had shied away from releasing singles from LPs. I think it stands beautifully as it is...maybe it could have been better...we will never know, in the way that we will never know what would have happened if 'Smile' had been released complete with 'Heroes and Villains', 'Good Vibrations' and 'Surf's Up' and their accompanying songs, when it had originally been intended, and not in bits and pieces in the following years. I often wonder about it.

I think Sgt P exists as an entity. I find it difficult to listen to individual songs...I want the whole or nothing at all, all tracks running into each other, all with the exhibition of these two musical geniuses supported by the superb and varied drumming of Ringo, and that wonderful producer - I'm not dismissing George H, but other than the glorious 'Within You, Without You' he is a bit player on the record...he comes out of his shell after this!

I didn't agree with all of Howard Goodall's input but I found it fascinating nonetheless...sometimes he wants to tell us TOO much. But it's still, over 50 years on, one of my favourite records. Lennon and McCartney...pretty marvellous actually as far as I'm concerned.

Thank you for these comments JC. It seems like sacrilege to try but as you have now said that time-wise only one track would have needed to be dropped, I think that would probably have been "Fixing a Hole" directly replaced by "Penny Lane" as follows. Both those tracks are ostensibly McCartney and "Penny Lane" works aurally as a segway from track 4 to track 6. I have a bit of a prejudice against "Fix" as while I accept the non-drug explanations to several of their songs (ie Lucy was a school friend of Julian's), I have never bought them as the be all and end all. The problem with "Fixing a Hole" is not that it might additionally have an LSD reference but that it might in addition to the explanation for it often given also have a reference to heroin. That to me is an issue, not that the drug has affected anyone I know. Similarly, I have an issue with Coldplay's "Fix You". Still, the song doesn't have to be the one that would have been ditched from the entire album. That as I will go on to discuss could for completely different reasons have been "Good Morning, Good Morning".

Side One

1. "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band"
2. "With a Little Help from My Friends"
3. "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds"
4. "Getting Better"
5. "Penny Lane" instead of "Fixing a Hole"
6. "She's Leaving Home"
7. "Being for the Benefit of Mr. Kite!"

Side two is much more difficult.

Tracks 1, 5 and 6 as they stand are all perfectly placed. With 1, it was essential that Harrison's Indian track went first to represent radicalism. However, I do feel that "Good Morning, Good Morning" is strangely positioned for what is essentially a breakfast cereal song. It could never have opened the album for obvious reasons but Liverpool band the Boo Radleys in the 1990s got this right by placing the rise and shine of "Wake Up Boo" as track 1 on their album "Wake Up". That was perfect plus it immediately defined the very loose concept of the album in its entirety. Given that it was probably an attempt by them to do their own Pepper, I think they had put a lot of thought into it and reached similar conclusions to mine.

Tracks 2, 3 and 4 on side two are all quite whimsical which perhaps adds to the strangeness set by track one and along with the reprise that certainly accentuates the unexpected weight of the final track. But I do feel that "Strawberry Fields Forever" belongs on this side as a substantial connection between the first and the last track. It's semi-mysticism can interplay with the first track and it would easily be segued as an alternative track two. However, I think that would have been too early and too obvious. Track 2 has to be a stark juxtaposition. "When I'm 64" does work as the second track by coming in as a jolt but then it is also true that so would some of the others. I think, on balance, I'd be moving "Good Morning, Good Morning" to track two as it sort of works as an alternative introduction to side two to "Within You, Without You" as if "Within You Without You" was a false start. I also like the fact that structurally the two have similar looking titles. I wouldn't have "Strawberry Fields Forever" as track 3 because there would be too obvious a read across to track 3 on side one which is the not dissimilar "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" so it has to be track 4. And I think "When I'm Sixty-Four" could then become track 5 with a natural shift from looking back to childhood in 4 to considering old age in 5. Alternatively "Good Morning, Good Morning" as a new track 2 could be ditched for "Fixing a Hole". Both, I think, are Lennon's.

Side Two

1. "Within You Without You"
2. "Good Morning Good Morning" or "Fixing a Hole" instead of "When I'm Sixty-Four"
3. "Lovely Rita"
4. "Strawberry Fields Forever" instead of "Good Morning Good Morning"
5. "When I'm Sixty-Four" instead of "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band (Reprise)"
6. "Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band (Reprise)" instead of "A Day in the Life"
7. "A Day in the Life" becomes the 7th and not the 6th track.

Incidentally, I am willing to critique what I am doing here.

First, it could be argued that to have "Penny Lane" immediately before "She's Leaving Home" is a double dose of tenderness which would not have been right for the overall tone. Also, some might say that to have "Morning" where it is placed is right as a part of the overall concept is to have time all awry. Also, re "Fixing a Hole" which McCartney very much later described as an "ode to pot" - I really don't think so - the direct read across in 1967 is surely to the Velvet Underground's "Heroin". Actually and perhaps oddly I don't have the same issue there because that was them and that was Warhol and they all looked like death warmed up anyway. It wasn't all circuses, grannies and children or the Salvation Army band.

[Lat-Literal]

I have got a couple of other comments based on contributors' posts.

First, in case it doesn't come across in this way, the Beatles are my favourite British (or American) group of all time. I think what they and George Martin did was "phenomenal". They didn't become my favourite group of all time until 1982 which is probably quite a good thing. It meant that I was open to all of what was arguably progression in the 1970s from the age of 7 to 17. My favourite album by the Beatles is "Abbey Road" and the second is probably "Rubber Soul" although I love them all. I also think, actually, that they tend to be a 9 or a 9.5 rather than a 10 but that of itself is interesting and adds to the charm with the key point being that almost everything they did over a lengthy period was as high as a 9 or 9.5.

Re Cloughie's point on Savoretti, I am in no doubt the modern industry's formulaic approach is like squeezing a flannel until every drop of water has left it. But I also think that flannel is the perfect description of many mainstream music people. There are eras of music and eras not of music. This is not an era of music. The 1960s were an era of music but then Virgo was in both Uranus and Pluto between 1962 and 1968. That happens only once in a blue moon. Probably. Re "Smile", I am still not absolutely sure JC quite how similar Brian Wilson's "Smile" in 2004 was to the original plan which is a terrible confession given I was at the concert, bought the album and would have got the t-shirt if I could have done. The track "Surf's Up" had, of course, gone on to the "Surf's Up" album in 1971 and then much later that was packaged with the "Sunflower" album on one CD. That is a fabulous disc too.

[Serial_Apologist]

One shouldn't forget when considering any negative connotations about LSD, from today's knowledge standpoint, had not really begun to play a part in criticism of any sort in 1967, when the drug was still viewed, even in mainstream areas of psychiatric research, as possibly liberating, and "bad trips" could be put down to happenstance, or misguidance by inexperienced companions, and were not yet appreciated as activating a potential predisposition towards lifelong psychosis.

[cloughie]

I have got a couple of other comments based on contributors' posts.

First, in case it doesn't come across in this way, the Beatles are my favourite British (or American) group of all time. I think what they and George Martin did was "phenomenal". They didn't become my favourite group of all time until 1982 which is probably quite a good thing. It meant that I was open to all of what was arguably progression in the 1970s from the age of 7 to 17. My favourite album by the Beatles is "Abbey Road" and the second is probably "Rubber Soul" although I love them all. I also think, actually, that they tend to be a 9 or a 9.5 rather than a 10 but that of itself is interesting and adds to the charm with the key point being that almost everything they did over a lengthy period was as high as a 9 or 9.5.

Re Cloughie's point on Savoretti, I am in no doubt the modern industry's formulaic approach is like squeezing a flannel until every drop of water has left it. But I also think that flannel is the perfect description of many mainstream music people. There are eras of music and eras not of music. This is not an era of music. The 1960s were an era of music but then Virgo was in both Uranus and Pluto between 1962 and 1968. That happens only once in a blue moon. Probably. Re "Smile", I am still not absolutely sure JC quite how similar Brian Wilson's "Smile" in 2004 was to the original plan which is a terrible confession given I was at the concert, bought the album and would have got the t-shirt if I could have done. The track "Surf's Up" had, of course, gone on to the "Surf's Up" album in 1971 and then much later that was packaged with the "Sunflower" album on one CD. That is a fabulous disc too.

...and a number of Smile tracks ended up Smiley Smile and Wild Honey.

[Lat-Literal]

One shouldn't forget when considering any negative connotations about LSD, from today's knowledge standpoint, had not really begun to play a part in criticism of any sort in 1967, when the drug was still viewed, even in mainstream areas of psychiatric research, as possibly liberating, and "bad trips" could be put down to happenstance, or misguidance by inexperienced companions, and were not yet appreciated as activating a potential predisposition towards lifelong psychosis.

Thanks for that S-A which is informed by you having been there - ie age wise you can recall those times whereas I was four and have had to fit the pieces. I don't have a problem with "Lucy" at all, that is, both as Julian's friend and LSD much for the reasons you outline. In fact, I would have thought that in connotation LSD was closer than cannabis to Alice. Heroin is trickier. Do you have a view on the cultural outlook towards it then? My instinct is that its darkness was well-known and on the avant-garde fringes sought in a nihilist way. The by-product was always what, if anything, it meant about promotion. The message in the art itself was "take it or leave it" but it also enjoyed popularity along with notoriety.

...and a number of Smile tracks ended up Smiley Smile and Wild Honey.

Yes indeed.