Ballet

[Lat-Literal]

BBC4 TV

Darcey's Ballerina Heroes:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b03xhbn8/darceys-ballerina-heroines

The third programme on ballet presented by Darcey Bussell I have watched. All interesting, informative - I started with virtually no knowledge - and well presented. It strikes me that perhaps surprisingly little is said about the ballet on this forum. Which members are the enthusiasts? The best ballet music? The best performances you have seen? What is the scope for it having a greater following in the future? I think that it has often as an art form been misrepresented and that its image(s) could be re-appraised so as to give it a wider appeal.

[teamsaint]

That's a bunch of questions there Lat !

For the best British ballet music, Arthur Bliss would be my place to start. The three best known scores, Checkmate , Miracle in the Gorbals , and Adam Zero are all excellent IMO. As I have said before, he seems to write so well for movement. Not that there is much to go on by way of visual evidence. I've scoured the internet for a performance, any performance of Adam Zero, and come up with a blank. There was a revival in Bremerhaven a couple of years ago, which I would absolutely love to have seen, but little sign of it reaching these shores.
Miracle in the Gorbals was revived in Birmingham in 2014 apparently, although it passed me by, sadly.

[vinteuil]

The best ballet music?

... Rameau, obvs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH57YDq8q8g

.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDbrOQIB6O0

.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP0uqPLjUzQ

.

[Serial_Apologist]

Have to confess to not being a big ballet fan. Maybe being made to sit through b&w broadcasts of the Sugar Plum as a child put me off, because the only performance I've ever seen that impressed me was of Bartok's Miraculous Mandarin. Or maybe I'm just lacking in the capacity department when it comes to juxtaposing the aural with the visual, being in general a head down, eyes closed type of listener. The music's fine when it's fine. Same goes for opera, but less often.

[gurnemanz]

I've been a fairly recent convert thanks to our daughter who regularly goes to ROH and has taken us along a few times. I loved Kenneth MacMillan's Das Lied von der Erde. (coming up again) - amazing interpretation of "ewig" at the end. Mayerling is extraordinary - also Macmillan. I found the Frederick Ashton "Enigma Variations" very moving. Great to see Stravinsky danced. I remember a very strong Stravinsky show at the Barbican - Apollo, The Rite of Spring and Les Noces with the Michael Clark Company. These are just a couple that come to mind.

[Pulcinella]

One of my great bugbears about ballet is that the music being used is often not identified in advance (apart fom the obvious instances such as Swan Lake, Petrushka, etc). Even the great tome I have (Balanchine's Festival of ballet) often merely says 'Music by....'.
I like to know what I'm going to hear, too.
The music being used for the forthcoming Bernstein triple bill at Covent Garden has not yet, as far as I know, been specified, apart from The age of anxiety.
Why is the music considered so subsidiary?

[Lat-Literal]

Am very grateful for all of the great responses to date and will await further ones with interest including in response to Pulcy's question.

TS - I agree on "Adam Zero" which I have on a Naxos disc with "A Colour Symphony".

[Pianorak]

The best performances you have seen?

On DVD only and just the first that come to mind and not in any particular order:

Swan Lake: Tchaikovsky, Ulyana Lopatkina, Mariinsky Theatre Version
Mayerling: Liszt, Irek Mukhamedov, Kenneth MacMillan, Royal Ballet
Romeo & Juliet: Prokofiev, T Rojo/C Acosta, Kenneth MacMillan, Royal Ballet
Elite Syncopations: Scott Joplin, Sarah Lamb, Kenneth MacMilan, Royal Ballet
Concerto: Shostakovich, Steven McRae, Kenneth MacMilan, Royal Ballet
Le jeune homme et la mort: JS Bach, Nicolas Le Riche, Roland Petit, Paris Opera Ballet


(Performances I liked the most and IMV are probably among the best).

[Serial_Apologist]

What do people think of music from the classical repertoire being used as an accompaniment to ballet, when they were originally not intended for this purpose, though?

[Pianorak]

What do people think of music from the classical repertoire being used as an accompaniment to ballet, when they were originally not intended for this purpose, though?

That really doesn't bother me. The point I'd make is that music specifically written for ballet tends to be at the very least not very engaging, to wit: Minkus (Paquita, La Bayadere) and Adam (Giselle, Le Corsaire).

[Quarky]

That really doesn't bother me. The point I'd make is that music specifically written for ballet tends to be at the very least not very engaging, to wit: Minkus (Paquita, La Bayadere) and Adam (Giselle, Le Corsaire).

Having had an interest in dance in the past, people go to Ballet to see the dancing, not to hear the music. That is why balletomanes will pay the earth to see the Kirov or the Bolshoi. As with a Jazz concert, people don't go to hear crazy rhythm, but to hear Django's improvisation around the theme.

Apologies if I'm missing the point here.

[Richard Barrett]

... Rameau, obvs.

Of course there's lots of great ballet music, from Rameau to Stravinsky and Ravel whose (IMO) best work was done in that medium. What I particularly like about Rameau's dance pieces is the way they seem to me to contain their own choreography, since the rhythms and gestures of the music are so suggestive of the movements they might accompany. Having said that, ballet as such seems to me a massively limiting and limited medium (compared to dance in a more general sense) and it's never appealed to me. The only time I can remember attending one was (the Nutcracker of course) to take my daughter when she was 5 or so. I was just interested in listening to the music; she coincidentally developed a high temperature and wanted to leave before the end; and that was that.

[Alain Maréchal]

music specifically written for ballet tends to be at the very least not very engaging, to wit: Minkus (Paquita, La Bayadere) and Adam (Giselle, Le Corsaire).

L'Oiseau de feu, Petrouhka, Le Sacre du Printemps, Danses Concertantes, Agon, were all specifically written for ballet. Its a pity you find them not very engaging.

If you have seen the ballets you cite, you might have noticed that the music does its job rather well.

I confess to being a balletomane. I have lost count of the number of Nutcrackers I have seen, and I am rarely unmoved. I would, if I could, travel Europe to see Petrouchka.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Of course there's lots of great ballet music, from Rameau to Stravinsky and Ravel whose (IMO) best work was done in that medium.

Having said that, ballet as such seems to me a massively limiting and limited medium (compared to dance in a more general sense) and it's never appealed to me.

The "mime" conventions of Classical Ballet seem very remote from me - and the effort involved in coming to terms with those conventions are far greater than any resulting rewards. (The only enjoyment I've ever got is from the comedy ballets, where the sheer ludicrous of the conventions is accepted and exploited.) And there's the problem of the thud of feet hitting stage with the resulting extraneous percussion added to the score. This is also true of "dance in a more general sense", but there the originality of movement, and the greater awareness of the effect of stage sound on Music is more carefully integrated. And often more exciting.

[Pulcinella]

Having had an interest in dance in the past, people go to Ballet to see the dancing, not to hear the music. That is why balletomanes will pay the earth to see the Kirov or the Bolshoi. As with a Jazz concert, people don't go to hear crazy rhythm, but to hear Django's improvisation around the theme.

Apologies if I'm missing the point here.

No, I don't think you're missing the point, but your observations and own experience seem to reinforce my bewilderment: why the music is generally deemed to be of such lower importance never ceases to amaze me!