Moral Maze - British Places : Better Represented By Classical Music Than Other Forms

[Pulcinella]

Returning to music supposedly evocative of place, would one honestly be able to hear what La Mer is "about" without knowing its title? Really? How?

Does it have to be 'about' anything? (Forgetting the quip 'about' -- sorry -- the bit relating to a particular time!)
I don't think that you'd imagine it was The Housatonic at Stockbridge, unless there'd been a particularly torrential downpour.
I'm not quite sure what your point is, Richard.
If a composer chooses to give a title to a piece to suggest an association (as a place of inspiration or an attempt at depiction) then so be it. I don't think I'd confuse the bleakness of Egdon Heath with the warmth of a Norfolk Rhapsody, but I'm not sure either piece is 'about' its given title.

Actually, I'm not at all sure what this whole thread is 'about'!
Perhaps we are in the world of semantics.

[Richard Tarleton]

Actually, I'm not at all sure what this whole thread is 'about'!
Perhaps we are in the world of semantics.

I see that Khatchaturian actually took the trouble to visit Spartacus locations in Italy before writing his music. But, thanks to the powers of suggestion, none of us over a certain age today can shake off images of effing sailing ships

[teamsaint]

Does it have to be 'about' anything? (Forgetting the quip 'about' -- sorry -- the bit relating to a particular time!)
I don't think that you'd imagine it was The Housatonic at Stockbridge, unless there'd been a particularly torrential downpour.
I'm not quite sure what your point is, Richard.
If a composer chooses to give a title to a piece to suggest an association (as a place of inspiration or an attempt at depiction) then so be it. I don't think I'd confuse the bleakness of Egdon Heath with the warmth of a Norfolk Rhapsody, but I'm not sure either piece is 'about' its given title.

Actually, I'm not at all sure what this whole thread is 'about'!
Perhaps we are in the world of semantics.

About 10 pages long on my desktop.....

[Pulcinella]

About 10 pages long on my desktop.....

[french frank]

Of course not - and, perhaps, if it were possible to do this, someone might ask why its composer wanted it to be evocative of Eastbourne...

According to Wikipedia, he only corrected the proofs there, so it would have been quite late in the compositional process that he decided to evoke the spirit of Eastbourne.

But does La Mer evoke an impression of the sea? Maybe the whole idea of giving it a title is to jog the listener's imagination in a particular direction? Give them a clue.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

But does La Mer evoke an impression of the sea? Maybe the whole idea of giving it a title is to jog the listener's imagination in a particular direction? Give them a clue.

I think that this is the central "problem" of this Thread.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Pulcie's mentioning Egdon Heath is useful - can a composer "evoke" (or worrevva) a place that doesn't exist?

(Feeble joke about Norfolk removed from Post. )

[EdgeleyRob]

I'd like classical music on cities and towns outside London.

John Kinsella

Symphony No 4 'The Four Provinces'

All about Ireland,alas not on you tube but it's in the Naxos Library

https://www.chandos.net/chanimages/Booklets/MP3766.pdf

Sir Charles Hubert Hastings Parry

Symphony No 2 'The Cambridge'

Nothing to do with Cambridge AFAIK (but the composer has a town in his name )

https://youtu.be/onJu597tR7Y

Alan Bush

Symphony No 2 'The Nottingham'

Commissioned for the quincentennary of the Royal Charter,each movement depicts a district of the city

https://youtu.be/0Qg3GHLYY9k

Richard Arnell

Dagenham Symphony

OK not outside London,all about car making,alas not on the web or Naxos,on a Dutton cd

http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2013/Jan13/Arnell_symphonies_CDLX7299.htm

David F Golightly

Symphony No 1 'The Middlesbrough'

Music and the beautiful game ! Extract here https://youtu.be/s_b2gtOUwic

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

David Golightly!!! Cheers, Rob - I was trying to remember both composer and city in title all yesterday!

Excerpts only, alas, available on youTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_b2gtOUwic

- the conductor himself referencing another location!

(Composer may be known to any Forumistas studying Music at Huddersfield Poly in the late '70s.)

[Richard Barrett]

Does it have to be 'about' anything?

No of course not.

[cloughie]

Pulcie's mentioning Egdon Heath is useful - can a composer "evoke" (or worrevva) a place that doesn't exist?

(Feeble joke about Norfolk removed from Post. )

A bit like supermarkets and their fictitious farms.

[LeMartinPecheur]

Pulcie's mentioning Egdon Heath is useful - can a composer "evoke" (or worrevva) a place that doesn't exist?

Hmm, yet another problem of semantics in this thread? Does Egdon Heath really not 'exist'?

You may not be able to find it so named on any Ordnance Survey map, but it seems to be well enough defined for the NT to have bought us all a decent slice of it!

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/06/national-trust-dorset-slepe-heath-thomas-hardy

[Serial_Apologist]

Hmm, yet another problem of semantics in this thread? Does Egdon Heath really not 'exist'?

You may not be able to find it so named on any Ordnance Survey map, but it seems to be well enough defined for the NT to have bought us all a decent slice of it!
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...h-thomas-hardy

A hardy perennial, methinks.

[teamsaint]

I'm struggling to see the difference between naming music,or giving linguistic clues within music, in order to assist in generating an effect for the listener, to creating a fictitious place in a novel, or film for example. They are both creative processes that use language to point to authorial intention, and the rest is up to us. Giving names to abstract impressionist works of art anybody ?

[Serial_Apologist]

I'm struggling to see the difference between naming music,or giving linguistic clues within music, in order to assist in generating an effect for the listener, to creating a fictitious place in a novel, or film for example. They are both creative processes that use language to point to authorial intention, and the rest is up to us. Giving names to abstract impressionist works of art anybody ?

They would usually tell the viewer something about the formal aspects of the painting, though, no? - in the same way a composer of abstract music often did back in the 1950s, eg "Gruppen".