Who are the Division 2 composers from Russia and other parts of Eastern Europe?

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  • Lat-Literal
    Guest
    • Aug 2015
    • 6983

    Who are the Division 2 composers from Russia and other parts of Eastern Europe?

    Who are the Division 2 composers from Russia and other parts of Eastern Europe?

    ie not in what is generally recognised as the top tier and not in the lower leagues.

    In your opinion (Let us say here that the top tier has 10-15 composers maximum).
  • ferneyhoughgeliebte
    Gone fishin'
    • Sep 2011
    • 30163

    #2
    Aside from Stravinsky and Mussorgsky, aren't all Russian composers in Division 2 (at best)?
    [FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]

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    • teamsaint
      Full Member
      • Nov 2010
      • 25231

      #3
      Originally posted by Lat-Literal View Post
      Who are the Division 2 composers from Russia and other parts of Eastern Europe?

      ie not in what is generally recognised as the top tier and not in the lower leagues.

      In your opinion (Let us say here that the top tier has 10-15 composers maximum).
      so do you mean second tier, ( championship) or league two,( tier 4) the one portsmouth are in?

      Anyway, league or no league, I nominate Chary Nurymov for promotion from the Turkmen league into the Europa league.

      I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own.

      I am not a number, I am a free man.

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      • makropulos
        Full Member
        • Nov 2010
        • 1677

        #4
        Originally posted by Lat-Literal View Post
        Who are the Division 2 composers from Russia and other parts of Eastern Europe?

        ie not in what is generally recognised as the top tier and not in the lower leagues.

        In your opinion (Let us say here that the top tier has 10-15 composers maximum).
        Hm. Not sure about sorting composers into league tables, but here goes with my choices for Czech composers.
        The super league would include: Smetana, Dvorak, Janacek, Suk, Martinu (and obviously Mahler if we're going by country of birth); they would be followed by Jan Novak, Vitezslav Novak, Foerster, Fibich, Ostrcil, Vycpalek, Pavel Haas, Schulhoff, Kapralova, Eben; after that, I suppose is where I get to your "Division 2", but there are some very interesting composers here - I certainly don't think of them as second-rate: Jezek, Fucik, Axman, Hurnik, Dobias, Jeremias, Kricka, Haba, Jiri Pauer... The list could go on and on.

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        • Lat-Literal
          Guest
          • Aug 2015
          • 6983

          #5
          Great comments so far and I am happy to welcome any posts about preferences.

          However, I am striving for an approximate "these would be generally recognised as the Championship".

          This on the basis that the Premiership might be:

          Bartok, Borodin, Chopin, Dvorak, Khachaturian, Liszt, Mussorgsky, Prokofiev, Rachmaninoff, Rimsky-Korsakov, Scriabin, Shostakovich, Smetana, Stravinsky and Tchaikovsky

          (or if not Khachaturian, Janacek or Glazunov)

          Here is a tentative one to set the ball fully rolling - Cui.

          Comment

          • BBMmk2
            Late Member
            • Nov 2010
            • 20908

            #6
            Originally posted by ferneyhoughgeliebte View Post
            Aside from Stravinsky and Mussorgsky, aren't all Russian composers in Division 2 (at best)?
            You kidding??
            Don’t cry for me
            I go where music was born

            J S Bach 1685-1750

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            • MrGongGong
              Full Member
              • Nov 2010
              • 18357

              #7
              Premier league

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              • french frank
                Administrator/Moderator
                • Feb 2007
                • 30507

                #8
                Voříšek and Vanhal?
                It isn't given us to know those rare moments when people are wide open and the lightest touch can wither or heal. A moment too late and we can never reach them any more in this world.

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                • jayne lee wilson
                  Banned
                  • Jul 2011
                  • 10711

                  #9
                  Very drawn to the soi-disants spiritual minimalists - so Gorecki, Gubaidulina, Arvo Pärt, but above all Giya Kancheli are very important to me.
                  Beyond that - Polish Music often has a strong slav feel to it - Lutoslawski and especially Panufnik.
                  I'm drawn back, ever hopeful, to Grażyna Bacewicz' concertos and quartets, but somehow never quite fall in love or develop that necessary obsession.

                  There's the small, fantastical oeuvre of the Lithuanian Mikalojus Çiurlionis, too; and ​Schnittke, especially the bleak, spare, otherworldly later symphonies (from 5 on) depending on the extremity of my mood.
                  But saving the best till last - Martinu, whose symphonies, concertos and string quartets I can never go for long without plunging into and glorying upon once again...

                  Comment

                  • Eine Alpensinfonie
                    Host
                    • Nov 2010
                    • 20575

                    #10
                    Originally posted by ferneyhoughgeliebte View Post
                    Aside from Stravinsky and Mussorgsky, aren't all Russian composers in Division 2 (at best)?
                    Hosts aren't supposed to be troublemakers (apart from me, of course).

                    Comment

                    • Eine Alpensinfonie
                      Host
                      • Nov 2010
                      • 20575

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Lat-Literal View Post

                      This on the basis that the Premiership might be:

                      Bartok, Borodin, Chopin, Dvorak, Khachaturian, Liszt, Mussorgsky, Prokofiev, Rachmaninoff, Rimsky-Korsakov, Scriabin, Shostakovich, Smetana, Stravinsky and Tchaikovsky
                      Well that list includes 2 Hungarians, A Czech and a Pole!

                      Comment

                      • Lat-Literal
                        Guest
                        • Aug 2015
                        • 6983

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Eine Alpensinfonie View Post
                        Well that list includes 2 Hungarians, A Czech and a Pole!
                        Yes - it's Russians and other Eastern Europeans.

                        There are already a lot of names that have surprised me which is good.

                        So much to consider with interest.

                        Makropolus suggests Suk among many others. I say yes to that one now.
                        Last edited by Lat-Literal; 11-02-17, 16:40.

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                        • Lat-Literal
                          Guest
                          • Aug 2015
                          • 6983

                          #13
                          Originally posted by jayne lee wilson View Post
                          Very drawn to the soi-disants spiritual minimalists - so Gorecki, Gubaidulina, Arvo Pärt, but above all Giya Kancheli are very important to me.
                          Beyond that - Polish Music often has a strong slav feel to it - Lutoslawski and especially Panufnik.
                          I'm drawn back, ever hopeful, to Grażyna Bacewicz' concertos and quartets, but somehow never quite fall in love or develop that necessary obsession.

                          There's the small, fantastical oeuvre of the Lithuanian Mikalojus Çiurlionis, too; and ​Schnittke, especially the bleak, spare, otherworldly later symphonies (from 5 on) depending on the extremity of my mood.
                          But saving the best till last - Martinu, whose symphonies, concertos and string quartets I can never go for long without plunging into and glorying upon once again...
                          In view of your recent comments on Martinu, Jayne, I am not surprised to see Martinu in your list and in my humble opinion he definitely qualifies. I am surprised and pleased to see that Gorecki and Part are included as I wasn't sure where to place them. I reckon it's a yes to Lutoslawski and Panufnik and will wait to see if there are any further comments about the others. Gubaidulina would surely also get ferney's vote on a different day. The one who is not on my radar at all is Giya Kancheli - so he will be interesting to explore.
                          Last edited by Lat-Literal; 11-02-17, 16:54.

                          Comment

                          • Eine Alpensinfonie
                            Host
                            • Nov 2010
                            • 20575

                            #14
                            Originally posted by Lat-Literal View Post
                            Yes - it's Russians and other Eastern Europeans.
                            I always into trouble at school for not reading the question.

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                            • Lat-Literal
                              Guest
                              • Aug 2015
                              • 6983

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Eine Alpensinfonie View Post
                              I always into trouble at school for not reading the question.


                              No mention yet of Glinka and also Balakirev who like Cui was one of The Five.

                              Perhaps they are no longer regarded as significant?

                              Among my favourites is Gliere but I don't know how well he is generally rated?

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