The Tyranny of Pop Music

[Bryn]

That almost reminds me of this:

"It has been said that because today more people hear Beethoven in twenty-four hours (on the radio) than heard him in his whole lifetime, the people have music. Momentarily disregarding the question of the quality of the emanations from the radio, we can say: yes, and a citizen doubtless sees more policemen now in twenty-four hours than Beethoven saw in his whole lifetime. The people hear more music and ipso facto they are more musical? The people have more law, and ipso facto they are more lawful?

The analogue[sic] is not so absurd....Hearing more music - ninety-nine per cent of which is not Beethoven but the equivalent of the radio vibrations of frankfurters - accomplishes just one thing: ennui in the eardrum."

The source? Again, guess! (although you might already be able to work it out for yourself or indeed already know)...

Hang on, I need a mug of tea before considering that one. I'm a tad ...

[MrGongGong]

Oh excellent, is was the actual sound that grabbed him.

Why is that automatically good in your opinion ?

I've never understood the reasoning that you have to understand classical music in order to like it.

So where have you read or heard this "reasoning" ?

I heard that listening to Mozart will make you smart

“Which is more musical, a truck passing by a factory or a truck
passing by a music school?
Are the people inside the school musical and the ones outside unmusical?
What if the ones inside can't hear very well, would that change my question?”

- Guess who?

"or are they Beethoven" ?

[Beef Oven!]

JFP?

[ahinton]

Hang on, I need a mug of tea before considering that one. I'm a tad ...

"You'll have had your tea!"...

No, I'm sorry that isn't a clue - just an attempted incentive...

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

MrGG, are you deliberately sticking pins in NatB? I find I'm very much in agreement with many of his points.

Though, as you know, I'd ban all electrical amplification.

[Beef Oven!]

MrGG, are you deliberately sticking pins in NatB?

Oh dear, the ''wife-beater'' question.

I find I'm very much in agreement with many of his points.

This is most irregular, me too

Though, as you know, I'd ban all electrical amplification.

[NatBalance]

In response to my statement "Oh excellent, is was the actual sound that grabbed him" you ask …

Why is that automatically good in your opinion ?

Mmmm, well, I can't really think what else can grab you about music that shows that you appreciate the music itself.

Now I'm not going off the subject. I am a fan of most of the American cars of the latter half of the last century but sometimes when I talk with owners of these cars I hear statements like "Well it's different. It's a head turner. I like big cars". Now what does that tell you about the owner? Are they actually true American car fans?

I think not. Those statements tell me that if those guys had been living in the States in those days they would probably have not had an American car because they would not have been different, not have been head turners and they'd be no bigger than any other cars on the roads. You see those guys are not really appreciating the cars themselves.

It's the same with music. If you do not appreciate the actual sound, if it's more to do with association or the accuracy to certain musical structures or originality that is more important, then you are not actually appreciating the music itself.

In response to my statement "I've never understood the reasoning that you have to understand classical music in order to like it" you ask:-

So where have you read or heard this "reasoning" ?

Well, I often hear and read it all over the place. Many a time someone has said it to me that they don't understand classical music. Coincidentally I recently heard it in Sarah Walker's video here:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JL9SXgU52z4

At about 0:55 she mentions that "…. sometimes the music is shrouded in things that you are not going to understand unless you've had a certain kind of education …". In fact I recall that one of my favourite composers, Gustav Holst, said about Vaughan Williams' Flos Campi words to the effect that he did not know what to think of it because he did not understand it. To which I would have asked him "Yes, but did you like it? Was it a good sound?".

[Bryn]

"You'll have had your tea!"...

No, I'm sorry that isn't a clue - just an attempted incentive...

I needed no clue, just the t(ea) to slake my thirst.

[MrGongGong]

It's the same with music. If you do not appreciate the actual sound, if it's more to do with association or the accuracy to certain musical structures or originality that is more important, then you are not actually appreciating the music itself.

Interesting, so you would say that the essence of music lies in the sonic experience when the music is actually happening and not anywhere else?
I can think of music that works in other ways (Feeding hay to pianos?).
Also, given that you have said elsewhere that you don't need to read or learn more about acoustics to be able to make judgements about relative volumes (or things about Gain Structure) how are you so sure in your view that this is the case?
And is it true for ALL music (as I know you like to have a theory of everything)

Well, I often hear and read it all over the place. Many a time someone has said it to me that they don't understand classical music.

All depends on what you mean by "understand", but it sounds like b*llocks to me, there's no secret single meaning.

You can't "spoil" the enjoyment of something by becoming more knowledgeable about it.

[Bryn]

Interesting, so you would say that the essence of music lies in the sonic experience when the music is actually happening and not anywhere else?
I can think of music that works in other ways (Feeding hay to pianos?). ...

Doesn't work if the hay gets eaten by some very old grasshoppers before the piano can get its fill.

[MrGongGong]

Doesn't work if the hay gets eaten by some very old grasshoppers before the piano can get its fill.

(The piece is over whether the piano decides to eat or not)

[Beef Oven!]

Bryn/MrGG

Apart from the LMY reference, what on earth are you on about!!??

[MrGongGong]

With
Dew on it's paws

[Bryn]

Bryn/MrGG

Apart from the LMY reference, what on earth are you on about!!??

In my case, being a wolf chasing the rabbit.

[Beef Oven!]

Eeeh, sooo terrik!