I just don't like the noise it makes.... (those 'blind spot' pieces)

[cloughie]

Whilst there's no more accounting for personal taste in 20th century violin concertos than in anything else in music, I fear that I fail entirely to figure out what constitutes aural assault or a showing off of the violin in an unpleasant way either in the concertos that you mention or indeed in the two each by Roslavets, McCabe, Rawsthorne, Malipiero, Dohnányi and Szymanowski, the seven by Bacewicz, the Bloch, the Maw, the Walton and those by Glazunov, Pfitzner, Menotti, Rochberg, Khachaturian, Rubbra, Dutilleux, Korngold, Goldschmidt, Holmboe, Ligeti, Jolivet, Frankel, Carter, Blacher, Skalkottas, Reger, Brian, Schoeck, Karłowicz, Stevenson, Weinberg, Delius, Sessions, Zimmermann, Alwyn and any that you can find by Merikanto - and that's just for starters...

I didn't say all C20th VCs! I have no problem with a few on your list some others I admit I've not heard yet. I guess it's a case of one person's pleasant listening is another's earache!

[ahinton]

I didn't say all C20th VCs! I have no problem with a few on your list some others I admit I've not heard yet. I guess it's a case of one person's pleasant listening is another's earache!

No, I know that you didn't - but "aural assault" and "a showing off of the violin in an unpleasant way" are not characteristics of many violin concertos that I can think of!

[cloughie]

No, I know that you didn't - but "aural assault" and "a showing off of the violin in an unpleasant way" are not characteristics of many violin concertos that I can think of!

Well there you go - that's the human ear for you!

... and the thread's heading is... we all like different noises.

[Pabmusic]

... "aural assault" and "a showing off of the violin in an unpleasant way" are not characteristics of many violin concertos that I can think of!

I'd agree. My feeling (note: this is not a cerebral thing at all) is that any concerto whose principal trait was simply "a showing off of the violin in an unpleasant way" would not last long enough in the repertoire. (Unless it was - say - a Dadaist or similar work that aimed to shock.)

[MrGongGong]

I'd agree. My feeling (note: this is not a cerebral thing at all) is that any concerto whose principal trait was simply "a showing off of the violin in an unpleasant way" would not last long enough in the repertoire. (Unless it was - say - a Dadaist or similar work that aimed to shock.)

I don't like the Tchaikovsky fiddle concerto either

[ahinton]

I'd agree. My feeling (note: this is not a cerebral thing at all) is that any concerto whose principal trait was simply "a showing off of the violin in an unpleasant way" would not last long enough in the repertoire. (Unless it was - say - a Dadaist or similar work that aimed to shock.)

Well, when one considers the concertos of Paganini and then Vieuxtemps, de Bériot and the like, one might seek to argue that they "show off the violin" (and the violinist!) more than most but, again, not in ways that I would credit as "unpleasant".

Schönberg (in)famously said of his concerto that he'd added another unplayable one to the repertoire (to which Sorabji's barbed response was that he had in fact subtracted one therefrom) but, although even Heifetz appears to have agreed with him, in this he was clearly wrong, for although it has never featured strongly in the repertoire, it has always had its advocates over the years and, in her already legendary recording, Hilary Hahn has silenced almost all doubters as to its place in the history of the violin concerto; fearsomely difficult as it is, I'm not sure that most would feel especially inclined to claim that it makes such a "showing off" of instrument or performer as those 19th century ones that I mention seem consciously to have done (or at least to have made no effort to avoid doing).

[ahinton]

I don't like the Tchaikovsky fiddle concerto either

But that's probably at least in part because the score omits a pair of gongs, surely?...

[MrGongGong]

But that's probably at least in part because the score omits a pair of gongs, surely?...

In the same way that there a very few foods that aren't improved by the addition of some of all of the following....... Garlic, Smoked Paprika, Lime Zest, Anchovies, Olive oil
there are few pieces (maybe Three Clarinets, Cello and Piano?) that aren't considerably enhanced by the addition of a Tam Tam (or 6)

[Richard Barrett]

I (Unless it was - say - a Dadaist or similar work that aimed to shock.)

Do you know any examples of Dadaist violin concertos???

[ahinton]

In the same way that there a very few foods that aren't improved by the addition of some of all of the following....... Garlic, Smoked Paprika, Lime Zest, Anchovies, Olive oil
there are few pieces (maybe Three Clarinets, Cello and Piano?) that aren't considerably enhanced by the addition of a Tam Tam (or 6)

Well, be that as it may (and I'm not about to list arguments against your food example!), I'm not going to be persuaded to revise me string quintet by adding any into its score, if it's all the same to you! Tam-tams in their place/s, say I (and there are undoubtedly plenty of those, as perhaps Messiaen understood as well as most)...

[ahinton]

Do you know any examples of Dadaist violin concertos???

Well, I don't know about Pabs, but all the head-scratching in the world brings none to what's left of my tiny mind, for all that there are several such concertos in A and an awful lot more in D...

[MrGongGong]

Well, be that as it may (and I'm not about to list arguments against your food example!), I'm not going to be persuaded to revise me string quintet by adding any into its score, if it's all the same to you! Tam-tams in their place/s, say I (and there are undoubtedly plenty of those, as perhaps Messiaen understood as well as most)...

You stick to your guns matey and don't go all Crummy

[ahinton]

You stick to your guns matey and don't go all Crummy

No, I'd not thought to introduce crumhorns either. Being a pacifist, I've no guns to which to stick, but I take your point, naturellement.

[MrGongGong]

No, I'd not thought to introduce crumhorns either. Being a pacifist, I've no guns to which to stick, but I take your point, naturellement.

I was thinking more of George

[ahinton]

I was thinking more of George

I did wonder that, actually - but no dice there either, notwithstanding my admiration...