18th Century Symphonists

[Lion-of-Vienna]

Completists intent on exploring the 18th century symphony are in for a frustrating time. In 1988 Jan LaRue, in "A Catalogue of 18th-Century Symphonies", lists 16558 works written between 1720 and 1810. I estimate that these would take over six months of continuous listening to get through and, if issued on single CDs, would take up around 50 metres of shelf space. The combined symphonies of Haydn and Mozart account for only 1% of these works and how many of us can say that we really know all of these pieces by the two best known composers of the period?

Then there is the perennial question of What is a Symphony? In the eighteenth century what we would nowadays recognise as symphonies were also known by a variety of other names such as Divertimento, Partita, Overture and Sinfonia. Even the title Concerto was applied to these works. Vivaldi's Concertos for Strings, which are often referred to as concertos without soloist, are effectively early symphonies. On the other hand the title Sinfonia Concertante to me means a concerto for several soloists rather than a symphony with soloists. It's a minefield!

A useful introduction to the 18th century symphony can be found in David Wyn Jones's essay that forms Chapter 1 of "A Guide to the Symphony" (ed. by Robert Layton, Oxford University Press, 1995).

[Dave2002]

Completists intent on exploring the 18th century symphony are in for a frustrating time.

Does it have to be frustrating? Some might like the challenge. Also, one does not necessarily have to be a completist in order to explore and enjoy the music.

[Lion-of-Vienna]

Does it have to be frustrating? Some might like the challenge. Also, one does not necessarily have to be a completist in order to explore and enjoy the music.

I completely agree. My opening remark was meant to be flippant. However, one way of enjoying a piece of music is to understand the context in which it was written. What were other composers writing at the time and what influences were at work on the composer? My point is that we are unlikely to ever come across 98% of the symphonies composed in this period so our knowledge is inevitably limited and I find that frustrating.

[MickyD]

Limited, yes, but surely we are luckier than ever to live at a time when so many groups and record companies constantly reveal these new treasures on CD. Even if they are only a fraction of those 16558 works, I still have difficulty keeping up with the new releases which appear!

[gurnemanz]

How about a Brit? I bought a Turnabout LP of Wiliam Boyce's 8 Symphonies many, many years ago on the erstwhile cheapo Turnabout label. It became something of a favourite and was enthusiastically welcomed by Stanley Sadie in Gramophone who described it as "outstandingly fine" and commented on its bargain status of 2 Shillings a symphony. I acquired the CD version from a market stall in Swindon but note that the recordings have just been re-issued on Alto with a Mozart bonus.

The only Boccherini Symphony I have is on the Lumières Box. It is very enjoyable, but not sure if I will stretch to the 8CD complete collection.

[EdgeleyRob]

More Brits,worth a listen from time to time IMO.

[richardfinegold]

Has anyone mentioned Mozart's drinking buddy the Bohemian Josef Myslivicek? I think I left out about half a dozen diacritics in the spelling. He was quite a character, a seducer right out of Don Giovanni, who wound up having his nose amputated due to syphillis, which I presume must of have curbed some of his extramusical activities. His Symphonies were covered in the Mathias Bamert series and are well worth listening to. He also wrote some Wind Serenades that sound very much like they could have been the model for Mozart's Gran Partita.

[MickyD]

There is also an excellent Myslivicek disc from the wonderful Concerto Koln...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Myslivecek-Symphonies-Concerto-K%C3%B6ln/dp/B000JFZ9FC/ref=sr_1_16?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1415776740&sr=1-16&keywords=myslivecek

As for other composers of the same period that you have never heard of, look no further than the CPO catalogue!

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/cpo/theme/-/tname/labelshop_cpo_komponistenverzeichnis?expid=1198312_2866&expfull=1

[MickyD]

This is another good buy...four symphonies by Franz Xaver Dussek (not to be confused with the later Dussek), by the admirable Helsinki Baroque Orchestra on Naxos.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Dussek-Symphonies-8-572683-Helsinki-Orchestra/dp/B0085AXTXW/ref=sr_1_2?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1415890549&sr=1-2&keywords=helsinki+baroque+orchestra

[doversoul1]

Has Johann Joseph Fux been mentioned? Only a few of his orchestral works are called symphony but what is interesting is that Fux was born in 1660 and lived until 1741. He must have seen a few changes in musical forms and styles.

Here is some of his Compositions for Orchestra

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAJo7xMXAKQ

[ed] Caldara lived in much the same time as Fux and composed a few symphonies but are their works more in the form of the 17 century?

[Lion-of-Vienna]

Franz Xaver Dussek (not to be confused with the later Dussek), [/url]

The Dusseks can be confusing, at least to me. Their names are also written as Dusek, Duschek or Dusik.

Frantisek Xaver Dussek (or Franz in German) lived from 1731 - 1799. He was Czech and spent most of his life around Prague where he became a friend of Mozart. Amongst a large number of works there are around 40 symphonies including the four on the recording recommended by MickyD. His wife, Josepha, was the soloist in the first performance of Ah, Perfido by Beethoven.

Jan Ladislav Dussek (1760-1812) was also Czech but no relation of FX. He was a piano virtuoso who travelled Europe and spent a decade living in London. He does not seem to have written symphonies but his list of works is dominated by piano works. Harold Truscott, in Chapter 3 of "The Beethoven Companion", cites JL Dussek, along with Clementi, as a major influence on the mature piano style of Beethoven. Since there are many recordings of the Sonatas (particularly on Naxos Music Library) it might be an interesting experience to listen to a few of these.

[MickyD]

Definitely, LOV....amongst my favourite recordings of J L Dussek's piano music are two discs Andreas Staier made for Deutsche Harmonia Mundi (on a Broadwood) and also two piano concertos with Concerto Koln for Capriccio. Marvellous stuff!

[kea]

Someone appears to be recording a new complete cycle of the Dussek piano sonatas (there are about 25 I think). I say 'someone' because I do not remember either the pianist's name or the record label, or for that matter what sort of instruments she is using. I just happened to spot vol. 1 in the bins at my local classical cd shop.

Staier's recordings are indeed excellent but I do think different aspects of Dussek's music can be brought out on modern pianos as well, as with Beethoven. The only satisfactory modern instrument recordings of Dussek I've heard are Markus Becker's on CPO.

Hyperion has also started recording Dussek's piano concertos for their 'Classical Piano Concerto' project.

[Despina dello Stagno]

I should like to further the English symphonists strand by endorsing the quality of [Frederick] William Herschel. Only two small drawbacks; he's no more English than Handel, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Herschel and they aren't (quite) symphonies.
Unfortunately, the recording industry hasn't been kind to him. They were never published in his lifetime (I have a photocopy of his autograph scores), and only a handful have been recorded. There is a London Mozart Players CD which tends to the dull (too much trumpet work in D major) but the link below shows the sort of thing of which he was capable in the late 1750s

Try to find the minor keyed items.

[MickyD]

I should like to further the English symphonists strand by endorsing the quality of [Frederick] William Herschel. Only two small drawbacks; he's no more English than Handel, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Herschel and they aren't (quite) symphonies.
Unfortunately, the recording industry hasn't been kind to him. They were never published in his lifetime (I have a photocopy of his autograph scores), and only a handful have been recorded. There is a London Mozart Players CD which tends to the dull (too much trumpet work in D major) but the link below shows the sort of thing of which he was capable in the late 1750s

Try to find the minor keyed items.

Yes, indeed...this sounds like great English Sturm und Drang, but in my opinion the music cries out for a good period orchestra. How about it, AAM, instead of more old Baroque warhorses?