‘Pop belongs to the last century. Classical music is more relevant to the future'

[teamsaint]

Perhaps the suits at the BBC might look back at what has happened to popular music over the last 20 years, (the internet age), and see if lessons can be learned.

One of the things that has happened is that access to a much wider range of popular musics has become much easier. I suspect that the stranglehold that white American /British rock music had on the "art" end of the popular music spectrum through the 60s 70 s and 80s has been well and truly ended. There are of course exceptions, such as Radiohead, but today, if one wanted to look for the unusual, thoughtful, imaginative in pop, there is, literally a whole world to choose from.
The market is there, but it has fragmented, and the supplier base has enlarged.

FFs question about opportunity to listen is important. The opportunity is already there. It is getting that opportunity to the top of people's wish list that is the problem. In my opinion, that is where branding, ( if you want to "sell" something), is so important. The biggest weapon at the BBCs disposal in regard to marketing music that is perceived as being outside of the popular, is the Proms. If I wanted to increase the reach of Radio 3s music, both in audience and musical scope, that is where I would start.
Whether that is actually desirable, is a whole different issue.

[french frank]

Perhaps the suits at the BBC might look back at what has happened to popular music over the last 20 years, (the internet age), and see if lessons can be learned.

One of the things that has happened is that access to a much wider range of popular musics has become much easier. I suspect that the stranglehold that white American /British rock music had on the "art" end of the popular music spectrum through the 60s 70 s and 80s has been well and truly ended. There are of course exceptions, such as Radiohead, but today, if one wanted to look for the unusual, thoughtful, imaginative in pop, there is, literally a whole world to choose from.
The market is there, but it has fragmented, and the supplier base has enlarged.

FFs question about opportunity to listen is important. The opportunity is already there. It is getting that opportunity to the top of people's wish list that is the problem. In my opinion, that is where branding, ( if you want to "sell" something), is so important. The biggest weapon at the BBCs disposal in regard to marketing music that is perceived as being outside of the popular, is the Proms. If I wanted to increase the reach of Radio 3s music, both in audience and musical scope, that is where I would start.
Whether that is actually desirable, is a whole different issue.

I think it's quite true that the Proms act, in some sense, as a 'promotion' for Radio 3 (and we know that the BBC is aware that many Proms-goers don't connect the Proms with Radio 3 - true, though the reverse is unlikely to hold!!!). I once had a conversation with an accountant (not for my small income, but to look at the BBC's company accounts). He was probably in his 40s and said that he had 'never heard of' Radio 3, which I thought odd for a numbers man who had heard of Radios 1, 2 & 4, if only that that piqued his curiosity).

Nothing will feature on people's wish lists if they haven't heard of it. And the primary aim should not be to boost Radio 3's audience but to ensure people have a REAL opportunity to experience the whole range of classical music (for 'classical' read any non mainstream genre). I don't know what success the Ten Pieces will have - but it is at least a start. But the nonsense is, as usual, to have most of the broadcasts on Radio 3, fuelling the suspicion that the assumption is that 'classical' music should be kept as far as possible away from The Music People Want To Hear.

[Quarky]

Radio 3 may not be the optimum venue for introducing people to classical music:

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

some observations:

let's not forget that this is a paid piece by a teaching fellow at the Royal Academy of Music and reads as such

talking to young musicians locally about music [whether Bo Didley or Beethoven or Roland Kirk] youtube is the vehicle of choice ... when i was young my big sister's records in the radiogram did the trick, but before that i would say that the Light Programme had a major impact by the time i was five in 1950, i was certainly listening for 'development' in music by then and top of my pops was the Trumpet thing that used to attributed to Purcell ... having a family member or close friend who is into it does far more than any media outlet, and classical music should be played far more than it is on R1 R2 R6 ..... the segmentation of music based on record store shelves has no truth in it at all and shame on Morley for not taking that apart rather than using the fallacies of the old record business as eternal truths ... the abject surrender of Suits@AuntRadio to this misbegotten approach is a national shame [but look at what they play with around the last night of the Proms]

all of the above commentary about playing it straight with authority is entirely correct, and reflects my experiences of listening to jazz in concert, in illustrated talks [at the local library] and on radio

the base metaphor of music as food is always somewhere in the argument [taste it eh] [menus] but this misses the truth of a life of listening and studying the musical arts ... it is not an act of consumption to listen to music but work in Dewey's sense of experience making the self - broadcasting is not 'selling food' it is developing and sustaining our culture at personal and social levels [commercial radio is seducing listeners but selling audiences to advertisers] ... it is this power of broadcasting to make selves that also entails that it can stultify and damage selves .... unremitting three chord tricks and beats Mr Morley are poison to the mind as any monotone diet is to the body


Pop is not dead in the sense intended but it has become toxic to the mind - is that what Mr M is saying? can Pop do or say anything meaningful and healthy? can Hollywood? Pop like sugar and saturated fat will be part of the 21st century but imho the BBC would be well shot of it ... just think of advocating that we should all eat sugar and fat because so many already do - that is the essence of the argument made for popular music on the BBC

as Oddball illustrates, we may well all know many talented young musicians playing all sorts of music, i do, they are unheard; why not air their efforts? why spend a huge budget airing Pop that the music industry pushes? why have playlists that restrict the music played to the Pop pushed by Cowell and his buddies? that is the real crime!
leave it to Cowell and the commercial outfits ...

[Richard Barrett]

some observations

This is why Calum Da Jazbo should have been appointed Controller of Radio 3.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

This is why Calum Da Jazbo should have been appointed Controller of Radio 3.

That parallel universe just gets more and more attractive, doesn't it.

[amateur51]

That parallel universe just gets more and more attractive, doesn't it.

[Beef Oven!]

Radio 3 may not be the optimum venue for introducing people to classical music:

An absolutely top-class musician. I think she's brilliant.

[Serial_Apologist]

I read that in the Observer last week and was slightly confused as to what he was getting at. It is easy to agree that that pop is by definition essentially that music which is candy floss and ephemeral and not meant to last. For me this definition is undermined by the fact that I still enjoy listening to many of those classic 60s hits of my youth (Beatles, Kinks, Who and the rest) just as much as Schubert, Schumann, Brahms, Wolf, Zemlinsky etc. Sometimes he refers to pop and sometimes to "pop and rock". It's hard to be quite sure where pop ends and rock begins. Is rock somehow the serious end of pop? Where do people like Dylan fit in? I do not know that much contemporary rock, but that which I do know and appreciate means just as much to me as contemporary classical music. Can't wait for the new Lucinda Williams. Out tomorrow. Exciting!

Wiki gives a pretty useful overview of the breadth of generic definitions the term Rock music encompasses:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_music

Have a good...... week!

[teamsaint]

Wiki gives a pretty useful overview of the breadth of generic definitions the term Rock music encompasses:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_music

Have a good...... week!

I don't think the Wiki article includes Funk pop a roll, S_A !!

Criticising things is easy. I should know, I do it enough.
But identifying the problem or enemy is important. Here is a lyric from a successful (at the time) musician, whose perspective on pop music and its industry will have been rather closer than most.


Funk pop a roll beats up my soul
Oozing like napalm from the speakers and grill
Of your radio
Into the mouths of babes
And across the backs of its willing slaves

Funk pop a roll consumes you whole
Gulping in your opium so copiously from a disco
Everything you eat is waste
But swallowing is easy when it has no taste

They can fix you rabbits up
With your musical feed
They can fix you rabbits up
Big money selling you stuff that you do not need

Funk pop a roll for fish in shoals
Music by the yard for the children they keep
Like poseable dolls
The young to them are mistakes
Who only want bread but they're force-fed cake

Funk pop a roll the only goal
The music business is a hammer to keep
You pegs in your holes
But please don't listen to me
I've already been poisoned by this industry!

Funk pop a roll beats up my soul

Andy Partridge. XTC.

here's the tune.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngOjVt0X1i4

sorry if that is Off topic. Train of thought.

Lordgeous will like it, at any rate.....