Wiener Philharmoniker Neujahrskonzert

[Pabmusic]

Butt - you must have a large head unless they are small goats.

Big head, Cloughie. To my shame.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

One person's banter is another's trollery. There is a tendency to dismiss others thoughts and ideas if they don't sit with one's own.

Well, yes - and other contributors' sensitivities should always be taken itno account - especially those of new members. (And I think the welcome given to Krystal on other threads showed the Forum at its best.) But the OP was couched in rather provokative vocabulary as if inviting equally robust responses - and Pet's response was, I felt, no more aggressive than that OP; certainly not troll-esque.

There are times when I peruse threads and think this is a club I don't want to join and may wish to leave. I don't think this forum is as friendly and welcoming as it was a couple of years ago.

I hope this isn't the case - and I hope you stay in the club, not least because of timely reminders such as this that those of us who have been posting since the days of semaphore have become used to each others' tone of "voice", which must be intimidating (or, at least, off-putting) to newcomers to the Forum. You're right - there's been a number of unfriendly spats recently, partly I think because we cannot hear a tone of voice, and a comment made tongue-in-cheek can be taken as having malicious intent (especially if the comment is about an artist who has particular importance to us). That's why I use those irritating smilies so frequently - it's the best I can do to communicate banter.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I think the important thing to remember is that every member deserves to be treated with respect, but at the same time every member should reciprocate and treat others as they would expect to be treated themselves. I don't think anyone was "trolling" on this occasion, but it's a reminder of how what we say online can be interpreted in different ways.

[richardfinegold]

What exactly is "trolling"?

I just read the Wikipedia definition. It seems that the key factor is Intent, that a Troll is deliberately out to stir a pot and disrupt the karma of a site. I think that what occurred here was an unfortunate misunderstanding and that no one had malicious intent.

[Ferretfancy]

There's a story about Brahms attending one of Strauss's rehearsals. During a break he took a look at the score of the beautiful Waldmeister Overture and pencilled in a counter melody while recognising the piece as " Not, sadly, by Johannes Brahms "

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

W I think that what occurred here was an unfortunate misunderstanding and that no one had malicious intent.

That would be my understanding too.

[Ferretfancy]

I should like it if they adopted the Barbirolli approach and some serious Viennese classics in the first half and the Strauss etc in the second half .

This was the approach at Barbirolli's Viennese Proms, but the effect was marred by the fact that some prommers at the front rail were restless during the first half and then indulged in idiotic bobbing up and down during the waltzes, which was maddening. This music deserves respect, and Barbirolli knew that.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

There's a story about Brahms attending one of Strauss's rehearsals. During a break he took a look at the score of the beautiful Waldmeister Overture and pencilled in a counter melody while recognising the piece as " Not, sadly, by Johannes Brahms "

I thought it was the opening of the "Blue Danube", written on Mrs Strauss' fan, that Brahms so autographed?

Either way, it takes some Musician to receive the equal admiration of both Brahms and Wagner. (IIRC, the very first Music heard at the public opening of Bayreuth was a Strauss waltz, conducted by Wagner.)

[ahinton]

I thought it was the opening of the "Blue Danube", written on Mrs Strauss' fan, that Brahms so autographed?

Either way, it takes some Musician to receive the equal admiration of both Brahms and Wagner. (IIRC, the very first Music heard at the public opening of Bayreuth was a Strauss waltz, conducted by Wagner.)

...indeed - and not to mention also Bruckner, Mahler, Schönberg, Berg and Webern!...

[Ferretfancy]

...ndeed - and not to mention also Bruckner, Mahler, Schönberg, Berg and Webern!...

I have a very nice Electrola LP by Ensemble 13 Baden Baden, the sleeve of which describes "The Society for private Musical Performances" at which Schoenberg, Webern and Berg presented their arrangements of Strauss Waltzes on 27th May 1921. After the performances the manuscripts were auctioned, raising about 45000 kronen, but due to the collapse of the Austrian currency this was not enough to prevent the society's closure later that year.
Schoenberg arranged the Kaiserwalzer and Rosen aus dem Suden, Berg arranged Wein, Weib und Gesang and Webern the Schatwalzer from Der Zigeuner Baron, and delightful they are! I particularly like the wheezy harmonium.

I haven't looked, but there must be nice recordings on CD, well worth seeking out

[slarty]

FF - I remember a DGG recording with Joseph Silverstein and the Boston Symphony Chamber Players back in the 70s - It included all the above.

[Ferretfancy]

FF - I remember a DGG recording with Joseph Silverstein and the Boston Symphony Chamber Players back in the 70s - It included all the above.

Yes, thanks for that, I thought that I had that version on the shelf, but it's gone missing!

[slarty]

Yes, thanks for that, I thought that I had that version on the shelf, but it's gone missing!

must be a conspiracy - mine too.

[CallMePaul]

FF - I remember a DGG recording with Joseph Silverstein and the Boston Symphony Chamber Players back in the 70s - It included all the above.

The Alban Berg Quartet also recorded these arrangements in the early 1990s, along with other Viennese waltz arrangements. Schoenberg's Kaiser-Walzer arrangement also appeared on a sampler. I don't think I've ever heard the Webern arrangement performed by any ensemble, on disc or radio - perhaps because the piece is less well-known than the others in its original format?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I don't think I've ever heard the Webern arrangement performed by any ensemble, on disc or radio - perhaps because the piece is less well-known than the others in its original format?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CiuBlOu_4A