Dave Hurwitz reviews - love 'em or hate 'em

[ucanseetheend]

Me too, since I recently got a copy of the score myself.
Surely there's nothing wrong in expecting a certain faithfulness to the score, if that's what his contention is?

"Certain faithfulness" and" interpretation " can be words to describe music anyway you want. Hurwitz raves about Bernstein all the time and says he conducts the music as the composer wrote it "99 % of the time" .I beg to differ.I won't list all but one infamous recording of Enigma Variations was certainly 'different' and as one orchestral player told Bernstein 'its not Elgar'

[Pulcinella]

"Certain faithfulness" and" interpretation " can be words to describe music anyway you want. Hurwitz raves about Bernstein all the time and says he conducts the music as the composer wrote it "99 % of the time" .I beg to differ.I won't list all but one infamous recording of Enigma Variations was certainly 'different' and as one orchestral player told Bernstein 'its not Elgar'

I'm now even more intrigued to see what he says about the KM DSCH6.


(I have a copy of that infamous Bernstein Enigma, and thought that the orchestra treated him abominably! Though it certainly counts as part of the aberrant 1%.)

[ucanseetheend]

I'm now even more intrigued to see what he says about the KM DSCH6.


(I have a copy of that infamous Bernstein Enigma, and thought that the orchestra treated him abominably! Though it certainly counts as part of the aberrant 1%.)

Except they believed Bernstein didn't respect the music and it's Hurgitz who thinks it's just 1% ,sure there are many others who would put it at a higher percentage.PS Still waiting for Gramophone website/ magazine review of the 3 symphonies

[Pulcinella]

Except they believed Bernstein didn't respect the music and it's Hurgitz who thinks it's just 1% ,sure there are many others who would put it at a higher percentage.PS Still waiting for Gramophone website/ magazine review of the 3 symphonies

Still no excuse for their behaviour, captured on film, unless they felt that they had the right to be equally prima donnaish and wanted to be seen being so!

Odd indeed that Gramophone didn't get a copy sufficiently in advance to have a review already published.
Next issue on sale 11 September. I wonder who the reviewer will be!

[ucanseetheend]

Still no excuse for their behaviour, captured on film, unless they felt that they had the right to be equally prima donnaish and wanted to be seen being so!

Odd indeed that Gramophone didn't get a copy sufficiently in advance to have a review already published.
Next issue on sale 11 September. I wonder who the reviewer will be!

Reviews often on the website before the printed edition..

[LHC]

I think his anti KM bias is unhinged. I’m not doing any boosterism for the Chicago Symphony here as I have a healthy dose of skepticism about such a young conductor being spread so thin internationally as the flavor of the year. However the new set of Shostakovich 4/5/6 if judged without all of the bias has plenty to recommend it and DH remarks are ridiculous. And yes his stance on Ormandy vs Solti makes little sense either. Two Hungarian Jews leading high profile American Orchestras for decades and both having strong interpretive profiles. How does one become angelic and the other satanic?
I think it should be realized that he does have a professional background in musicology, but that his need to generate clicks reinforces what is probably a natural tendency to view things in a
manichean manner.

I suspect the reason Hurwitz regards Ormandy as 'angelic' and Solti as 'satanic' is that Ormandy emigrated to America and became an American Citizen, while Solti stayed in Europe and eventually became a British Citizen, and even worse, was Knighted by the Queen.

[richardfinegold]

I suspect the reason Hurwitz regards Ormandy as 'angelic' and Solti as 'satanic' is that Ormandy emigrated to America and became an American Citizen, while Solti stayed in Europe and eventually became a British Citizen, and even worse, was Knighted by the Queen.

It’s funny, but despite the “Sir Georg” being part of his moniker, I always think of Solti as being fairly Americanized due to his long tenure here. As to what goes on in the brain of D.H. who knows?

[gradus]

Oddly I think there has been an engrained indifference to Ormandy over here. Relatively few of his recordings are regarded as leaders in their field whereas Solti has had many although his star has waned lately. I can't remember Ormandy ever coming over here or working with UK and European orchestras, perhaps that's why?

[HighlandDougie]

Oddly I think there has been an engrained indifference to Ormandy over here. Relatively few of his recordings are regarded as leaders in their field whereas Solti has had many although his star has waned lately. I can't remember Ormandy ever coming over here or working with UK and European orchestras, perhaps that's why?

He conducted the LSO in 1967, in a concert which included the first Western performance of the DSCH 2nd Violin Concerto (with David Oistrakh), and also recorded Dvorak's "New World" with them, which CBS issued at mid-price. Not sure about anything else. Yes, I think that there was a degree of indifference (I was going to say snobbery) about Ormandy which was probably misplaced.

[Barbirollians]

I am not sure it is correct that Ormandy's recordings were only given a lukewarm reception. That New World, his Shostakovich and his Sibelius Four Legends are all examples of recordings given a very warm reception .

Hurwitz is a self-promoting buffoon - his reviews are about him and his ego not the music IMO.

[richardfinegold]

I am not sure it is correct that Ormandy's recordings were only given a lukewarm reception. That New World, his Shostakovich and his Sibelius Four Legends are all examples of recordings given a very warm reception .

Hurwitz is a self-promoting buffoon - his reviews are about him and his ego not the music IMO.

Agree about DH. I’m being redundant but I think that he probably knows he is being OTT because it is in his interest to be so.
The anti Ormandy bias isn’t confined to the UK. There was somewhat of a revisionist backlash that emerged on these shores that started about the time he stepped down. I attended the University of Michigan in the late 1970s and Ormandy and Philly had a close relationship with the school. They gave a 4 day festival at the end of the school year that I loved; I remember a couple of years having to wrangle permission to stay a few extra days in my housing. Many Philly orchestra members retired from the orchestra and joined the faculty and I had music school friends that studied with these players.
So I would be stunned after attending concerts to hear the critics (in those days the New York Times and Philadelphia Enquirer would send reviewers) savage Ormandy. I had music loving friends in Philly who would do the same.
Sony had been releasing mega CD compilations of Ormandy/ Philly that I think have swung the pendulum back. There is a tremendous amount of premieres included, and plenty of sparkling renditions of everything else. Yes, certain composers fare better than others, but even the composers that Ormandy supposedly butchered (Mozart and Haydn) sound pretty acceptable.

[oliver sudden]

Careful, you’ve got me curious. I’ll be watching the video next…

Some of that was a little bit informative, some of it was interesting but a species of hair-splitting anyone with a score and the ability to read it could carry out with 90% of recordings without invalidating them as interesting recordings, much too much of it was just plain rude, and stupid rude at that. Can he not at least be a bit more creative in his insults than just saying ‘has no balls’ over and over again?

(And always the problem that I can’t really take seriously someone’s comments on an art which is largely sound-based if he chooses to express them (and it is ultimately a choice) in such a whiny, scratchy voice.)

[Barbirollians]

Some of that was a little bit informative, some of it was interesting but a species of hair-splitting anyone with a score and the ability to read it could carry out with 90% of recordings without invalidating them as interesting recordings, much too much of it was just plain rude, and stupid rude at that. Can he not at least be a bit more creative in his insults than just saying ‘has no balls’ over and over again?

(And always the problem that I can’t really take seriously someone’s comments on an art which is largely sound-based if he chooses to express them (and it is ultimately a choice) in such a whiny, scratchy voice.)

He cannot help his voice - its the highly unpleasant unreasoned things he says with it that offends me .

[oliver sudden]

He cannot help his voice - its the highly unpleasant unreasoned things he says with it that offends me .

I’m fairly sure he could do something about the voice if he chose to. I don’t think there’s anything physiologically wrong with it, which if I’m right would mean that if he has listened to his own stuff he has been happy with the sound, which for me does undermine the enterprise somewhat.

But in any case it is indeed the insults that even a schoolyard would find lacking in nuance and variety that are the real problem, yes.

[richardfinegold]

I’m fairly sure he could do something about the voice if he chose to. I don’t think there’s anything physiologically wrong with it, which if I’m right would mean that if he has listened to his own stuff he has been happy with the sound, which for me does undermine the enterprise somewhat.

But in any case it is indeed the insults that even a schoolyard would find lacking in nuance and variety that are the real problem, yes.

Look how successful DH is. His goal is to generate controversy to drive clicks to his site. This length of this thread shows how he has achieved that