Our Summer BAL no. 29: Bartok Violin Sonatas

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  • visualnickmos
    Full Member
    • Nov 2010
    • 3614

    Our Summer BAL no. 29: Bartok Violin Sonatas

    It appears that these masterpieces of 20th century music for violin and piano are not as prolifically represented as perhaps they should be; this should make for a clear and concise debate as to which is the "preferred" version...
  • umslopogaas
    Full Member
    • Nov 2010
    • 1977

    #2
    I have:

    Number 1. Oistrakh and Richter; Hyman Bress and Charles Reiner; Andre Gertler and Diane Andersen.

    Number 2. Joseph Szigeti and Bela Bartok; Hyman Bress and Charles Reiner.

    All on LP (the Szigeti and Bartok presumably issued originally on 78s). I first heard no. 1 in the Gertler and Andersen version, on Supraphon and no. 2 by Bress and Reiner, on RCA. The Szigeti and Bartok is very special, but I didnt come across it until quite recently. I dont know these works well enough to make a choice, but to my uncritical ears they all sound fine. For no. 1 I should think you'd be safe with Oistrakh and Richter and for no. 2 you could hardly do better than the composer himself at the piano, if you dont mind a rather vintage sound.

    The Penguin Guide 2010 likes Gyorgy Pauk and Jeno Jando on Naxos and Christian Tetzlaff and Leif Ove Andsnes on Virgin. No mention of the composer's own version of no. 2, which is odd; I can hardly believe that such a historic performance has dropped out of the catalogue?

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    • ferneyhoughgeliebte
      Gone fishin'
      • Sep 2011
      • 30163

      #3
      Originally posted by umslopogaas View Post
      The Penguin Guide 2010 likes Gyorgy Pauk and Jeno Jando on Naxos
      I have these - they are very good.

      No mention of the composer's own version of no. 2, which is odd; I can hardly believe that such a historic performance has dropped out of the catalogue?
      Still available, and affordable - but you have to rootle through Amazon to find it:
      [FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]

      Comment

      • Zucchini
        Guest
        • Nov 2010
        • 917

        #4
        Faust by a country mile (again)

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        • LeMartinPecheur
          Full Member
          • Apr 2007
          • 4717

          #5
          Originally posted by Zucchini View Post
          Faust by a country mile (again)
          Faust's are my sole modern versions on CD and I'm not rushing to replace her I also have the 1st from Menuhin which is well worth the Naxos price, coupled as it is with his pioneering account of the violin concerto http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bartok-Violi...sonata+menuhin

          On LPs I still have Stern on CBS from which I first made the acquaintance of these distinctly challenging works. Some time I must re-spin them and see how they measure up to the lovely Isabelle.
          I keep hitting the Escape key, but I'm still here!

          Comment

          • AmpH
            Guest
            • Feb 2012
            • 1318

            #6
            Gidon Kremer and Martha Argerich caught beautifully live in Berlin's Philharmonie in 2006 are superlative in the first sonata imv - part of a live 2cd set which includes Kremer's compelling performance of the challenging solo sonata. Pity they didn't record the second sonata as well. Of the more modern recordings, I have heard Faust and Ehnes, but these seemed rather insipid in comparison to Kremer and Argerich.

            Can't recall hearing any recordings of the second sonata which have really grabbed me, but I must investigate the Szigeti / Bartok recording as I haven't heard this.

            Comment

            • umslopogaas
              Full Member
              • Nov 2010
              • 1977

              #7
              AmpH

              In my dimly remembered memories of science, Am might be a reference to the Ampere, a measure of electrical power, and pH was definitely a measure of the acidity of a solution as noted by its hydrogen ion concentration, and I know this because I often had to measure those values and I was never sure about the reliability of the pH meter or of my knowledge of reading it.

              So welcome from a befuddled scientist, I prowl these pages constantly, but seldom find anything of value to contribute.

              But you must investigate Bartok's own performance. I have two versions on LP, both the same performance: on Philips (European issue) or Vanguard (USA issue) and both in the same cover design. I have no idea if they were ever re-issued on CD, but I will be surprised if they weren't.

              Just trying the American Vanguard LP right now: it is astonishing, just as if Bartok and Szigeti were suddenly invited to perform in your living room. These "vintage" recordings can be a bit difficult for modern ears if they are large-scale orchestral items, but if they are chamber music and like me you are not a musician, just a fan of recorded music, you'd never know about the limitations of seventy year old recordings.

              Comment

              • Eine Alpensinfonie
                Host
                • Nov 2010
                • 20575

                #8
                Just to avoid confusion, I've amended the title, renumbering it. There was already a 28...

                Comment

                • ferneyhoughgeliebte
                  Gone fishin'
                  • Sep 2011
                  • 30163

                  #9
                  Originally posted by umslopogaas View Post
                  I have no idea if they were ever re-issued on CD, but I will be surprised if they weren't.


                  (Second "paragraph", #3, umslops.)
                  [FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]

                  Comment

                  • visualnickmos
                    Full Member
                    • Nov 2010
                    • 3614

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Eine Alpensinfonie View Post
                    Just to avoid confusion, I've amended the title, renumbering it. There was already a 28...
                    Apologies - my fault for not looking properly.

                    Comment

                    • richardfinegold
                      Full Member
                      • Sep 2012
                      • 7747

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Zucchini View Post
                      Faust by a country mile (again)
                      Mephistopheles by a furlough?

                      Comment

                      • Parry1912
                        Full Member
                        • Nov 2010
                        • 965

                        #12
                        Has anyone heard the Kelemen/Kocsis recording that's shortlisted for a Gramophone Award?
                        Del boy: “Get in, get out, don’t look back. That’s my motto!”

                        Comment

                        • AmpH
                          Guest
                          • Feb 2012
                          • 1318

                          #13
                          Originally posted by umslopogaas View Post
                          AmpH

                          In my dimly remembered memories of science, Am might be a reference to the Ampere, a measure of electrical power, and pH was definitely a measure of the acidity of a solution as noted by its hydrogen ion concentration, and I know this because I often had to measure those values and I was never sure about the reliability of the pH meter or of my knowledge of reading it.

                          So welcome from a befuddled scientist, I prowl these pages constantly, but seldom find anything of value to contribute.

                          But you must investigate Bartok's own performance. I have two versions on LP, both the same performance: on Philips (European issue) or Vanguard (USA issue) and both in the same cover design. I have no idea if they were ever re-issued on CD, but I will be surprised if they weren't.

                          Just trying the American Vanguard LP right now: it is astonishing, just as if Bartok and Szigeti were suddenly invited to perform in your living room. These "vintage" recordings can be a bit difficult for modern ears if they are large-scale orchestral items, but if they are chamber music and like me you are not a musician, just a fan of recorded music, you'd never know about the limitations of seventy year old recordings.
                          umslopogaas - plenty of amps coursing through the Kremer / Argerich recording, which is definitely not pH neutral !

                          A quick search on Amazon UK reveals that the Szigeti / Bartok performance of the second sonata seems to have been issued on cd several times.

                          Comment

                          • ferneyhoughgeliebte
                            Gone fishin'
                            • Sep 2011
                            • 30163

                            #14
                            Originally posted by AmpH View Post
                            A quick search on Amazon UK reveals that the Szigeti / Bartok performance of the second sonata seems to have been issued on cd several times.


                            [FONT=Comic Sans MS][I][B]Numquam Satis![/B][/I][/FONT]

                            Comment

                            • AmpH
                              Guest
                              • Feb 2012
                              • 1318

                              #15
                              Originally posted by ferneyhoughgeliebte View Post
                              I hereby acknowledge that on the 20th August 2013, the Rt Hon member for Huddersfield , Ferneylongname MP , did kindly identify the availability and source of the performance of the second violin sonata of Bela Bartok ( performed by Messrs Szigeti and the composer ) on CD, which ( being on Spotify ) has subsequently provided AmpH with considerable musical enrichment and delectation and enabled the purchase of the said CD with confidence and reassurance.

                              Thanks be to Bartok .......... ( and to another forum member for advice on long sentence construction )

                              Amen

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