Our Summer BaL 33: Stravinsky Symphony of Psalms

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  • Pulcinella
    Host
    • Feb 2014
    • 11136

    #31
    Having agreed to verismissimo's request, and finished the ironing, I then felt very daunted.
    I hope that fellow boarders will not ridicule my very personal reactions to the recordings I have: I claim no expertise in orchestral playing (so the prospect of low piano oboe notes holds no terror!) but am a singer, keyboard player, and occasional conductor (living in the hope that the performance of JSB's Magnificat I conducted will let me through the pearly gates if they exist!).
    But I sat down with my `pocket' score, and made a note of places where I would specifically listen to how the performances coped. For those with an interest, and the score, here's my list.

    Movement 1
    Opening chord: the third quaver of a 2/4 bar, with a quaver rest after; marked mf. Immediate impression of orchestral clarity/recorded acoustic, etc.
    Woodwind accompaniment to altos (fig 4 and fig 7).
    Ability to distinguish piano 2 playing (with flutes) semiquavers against harp and piano 1 quavers (e.g., at figure 9 and especially at climax, figure 12).
    From figure 10, no crescendo marked until one bar before figure 12.

    Movement 2
    Speed (alerted by Markevitch timing).
    Woodwind intonation (fears for Ansermet/OSR!).
    Tuning in choral stretto (figure 10).
    Audibility of tromba piccola (admittedly marked sub pp) from figure 17 to the end.

    Movement 3
    Opening speed.
    Attack at tempo change (figure 3): sf sub p e stacc.
    How much of a scramble things sound at figure 5 (and similar later).
    Transition into Intro repeat (figure 12).
    Transitions/tempo changes at figure 20 and figure 22 (also figure 26).
    Tenors coping with their top note (marked non cresc.) between figures 23 and 24 (and repeated later).

    I then listened to four of my recordings, and (not surprisingly) some of the points listed above mattered more than others. Not likely to do much more today: cleaner due shortly and even Stravinsky cannot compete against manic hoovering; then it's my afternoon volunteer reading session at a local primary school.

    Spoiler alert: Rattle was one of the four I listened to yesterday, but it did not make it to the top of my list.

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    • verismissimo
      Full Member
      • Nov 2010
      • 2957

      #32
      Well done, Pulci! I'm not used to this kind of influence on boarders. Look forward to hearing further reports...

      Comment

      • Stanfordian
        Full Member
        • Dec 2010
        • 9332

        #33
        Originally posted by Barbirollians View Post
        Rattle for me - ducks to avoid the usual anti-Rattle brickbats
        Hiya Barbirollians,

        In the Symphony of Psalms I most admire the two accounts from the Berliner Philharmoniker the first by Boulez and the second by Rattle.

        Comment

        • HighlandDougie
          Full Member
          • Nov 2010
          • 3108

          #34
          Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
          For those with an interest
          Very much!! Many thanks for the deconstruction - better than most of the 45 minutes we get on a Saturday morning. I await the outcome keenly.

          Comment

          • Pulcinella
            Host
            • Feb 2014
            • 11136

            #35
            Update!

            Three more recordings listened to (including the Markevitch); four to go!
            The timing of the second movement in the Markevitch is so anomalous that the range above would be better given as 6:14 (Shaw) to 8:10, taking Stravinsky's CBC recording to the fast end rather than the middle of the road!
            Having realised that my pocket score is the revised 1948 version, I wondered if Markevitch could possibly be using a different (earlier) edition, perhaps with a misprint, or had misread quaver = 60 as crotchet =60. The Philips liner notes give no recording date for it, but then the overall dates do not really make sense, as a production date of 1963 is one of those given though no recording is listed as being before 1964!
            However, the mystery is somewhat resolved by details of the Publisher/Verlag/Edition for the Symphony of Psalms: S & N Koussevitsky.
            It's a thrilling but eccentric performance, so not the number one choice!
            I won't get diverted into trying to find out more about editions at this stage.

            Comment

            • Pulcinella
              Host
              • Feb 2014
              • 11136

              #36
              Postscript to update!

              I meant to say that what I particularly liked about the Markevitch was the resonance given to the bottom harp and piano notes at the start of the third movement (perhaps an editorial emphasis?), giving a feeling of deep-tolling Russian bells!

              A quick count of bars in the second movement results in a total of just under 360 quavers, which at 60 to the minute would give an overall timing of just under 6 minutes!

              Comment

              • Pulcinella
                Host
                • Feb 2014
                • 11136

                #37
                Here is the list of the 11 recordings I have listened to.
                I ignored the BBC Music Magazine one, as it is not commercially available.

                Ansermet/Choeur des jeunes de Lausanne and Choeur de Radio Lausanne/OSR
                Bernstein/English Bach Festival Chorus/LSO
                Bertini/Chor und Radio-Symphonieorchester Stuttgart
                Craft/Simon Joly Chorale/Philharmonia (Naxos incarnation)
                Markevitch/Boys' and Male voices of the Russian State Academy Chorus/Russian State Symphony Orchestra
                O'Donnell/Choir of Westminster Cathedral/City of London Sinfonia
                Preston/Choir of Christ Church Cathedral, Oxford/London Sinfonietta
                Rattle/Rundfunk Chor Berlin/Berliner Philharmoniker
                Shaw/Atlanta Symphony Orchestra & Chorus
                Stravinsky/Festival Singers of Toronto/CBC Symphony Orchestra
                Michael Tilson Thomas/LSO and Chorus

                Although not a blind listening, I tried to be objective and put preconceptions aside.
                I now need to listen to my `winner' again, to see if it really does hit the spot (or tick most of my boxes), or is it just familiarity, with it being significantly the most played here in Casa Pulcinella (and in previous places of habitation!).

                My partner was looking forward to a clear-out of the shelves, making room for new purchases: no such luck!

                Many thanks to HighlandDougie for the original suggestion: I would love this to be the subject of a real BAL, with more versions being compared and discussed.
                Also to verismissimo, for encouraging me to listen more objectively than I might otherwise do.

                Comment

                • Bryn
                  Banned
                  • Mar 2007
                  • 24688

                  #38
                  Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post
                  ... Back on topic, I have found that I have 12 versions of the Symphony of Psalms on my shelves, and the Craft recording twice (Koch and Naxos). Not sure how sad that is.

                  Even sadder, perhaps, I jotted down the movement timings from the liner information.
                  Some interesting timing differences, though perhaps not completely trustworthy, as even the two Craft recordings differ, by 7 seconds in movement 1. ...
                  Oh that's far too confusing. What about the earlier and swifter Craft/St. Luke's recording issued on the Music Masters label in 1991?

                  1: 3'06"
                  2: 5'35"
                  3: 9'26"
                  Last edited by Bryn; 15-07-14, 11:04. Reason: Link added.

                  Comment

                  • Pulcinella
                    Host
                    • Feb 2014
                    • 11136

                    #39
                    Stop Press!
                    Late addition!!

                    Putting the versions I had listened to back on the shelves, I discovered I had yet another (I thought that the box contained only the ballets):
                    Chailly/Rundfunkchor Berlin/Radio-Symphonie-Orchester Berlin

                    Timings are 3:11, 6:02, 11:05!

                    Comment

                    • Pulcinella
                      Host
                      • Feb 2014
                      • 11136

                      #40
                      For me, the version I would rescue from my shelves if Casa Pulcinella were to catch fire is the Bernstein.

                      Yes, the middle movement is slow, and the third flute seems to get the rhythm wrong in the bar after the one numbered 4, but it is more coherent than many other faster performances.

                      And familiarity probably did play a role: I have had this recording for a very long time (LP coupled with Poulenc's Gloria).

                      I really could not have as my only version one that is not sung in the ecclesiastical Latin I was brought up with: a prejudice that I had to take on board when choosing.

                      The clinchers, for me, apart from the choral sound/blend etc, are the audibility of the pianos (for me it is significant that Stravinsky uses the two pianos: I like the association with the percussiveness of Les Noces) and the brass/wind blend (echoes of the Symphonies of Wind).

                      I would like to hear (and hear about) other versions (I have a dim memory of owning the Ancerl on LP once), and look forward to other contributions here.

                      Comment

                      • verismissimo
                        Full Member
                        • Nov 2010
                        • 2957

                        #41
                        So... Bernstein from Pulci. Thanks for all your thoughts.

                        It's such an arresting work - from the first note/chord. Loving listening to my Stravinsky/CBC recording this week.

                        Comment

                        • Pulcinella
                          Host
                          • Feb 2014
                          • 11136

                          #42
                          Yes, that recording is very special for me too. I loved the cover of the LP, where it was coupled with the Symphony in C. I would hope to be able to rescue my big box of Sony Stravinsky CDs from any potential fire too!

                          Comment

                          • Lordgeous
                            Full Member
                            • Dec 2012
                            • 837

                            #43
                            Slight deviation but I had the thrill of hearing IS conduct it live in Oxford Town Hall - part of the Oxford Bach Festival - in the 1960s (Craft conducted the 1st half of the concert - Bach if I recall correctly). I think performers were the LSO and fresh student voices of the Oxford Schola Cantorum. Momentus occasion. Has anyone else attended a live performance conducted by IS?

                            Comment

                            • rauschwerk
                              Full Member
                              • Nov 2010
                              • 1483

                              #44
                              I have Maazel and Ancerl and hope to do a comparison of those with Bernstein later this week.

                              Comment

                              • Pulcinella
                                Host
                                • Feb 2014
                                • 11136

                                #45
                                Originally posted by Lordgeous View Post
                                Slight deviation but I had the thrill of hearing IS conduct it live in Oxford Town Hall - part of the Oxford Bach Festival - in the 1960s (Craft conducted the 1st half of the concert - Bach if I recall correctly). I think performers were the LSO and fresh student voices of the Oxford Schola Cantorum. Momentus occasion. Has anyone else attended a live performance conducted by IS?
                                According to Craft's The Chronicle of a Friendship, that concert was on 29 June 1964. He doesn't say what the rest of the concert was. Makes sense that it was Bach, though.

                                Bernstein seems to have taken over duties later at the festival: both the SofP and his later (DG) recording of Les Noces and the Mass are with the English Bach Festival Chorus, with Nicholas Cleobury (who was certainly involved with Schola Cantorum) credited as being chorusmaster on the DG recording. He is the honorary patron of the society I sing with, so I shall try to remember to ask him for his recollections the next time we meet (he comes to our concerts).
                                Last edited by Pulcinella; 16-07-14, 07:51.

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