BaL 1.03.14 - Beethoven Symphony no. 7 in A

[Barbirollians]

I agree that the decision to BAL this and not the Eroica is baffling. The choice of Mr Deathridge whose Pastoral came up with the eccentric if interesting cassette tape recording of C Kleiber's 6 was very odd is depressing .

C Kleiber's VPO 7 would be a safe and excellent choice though. I have a soft spot for the Philharmonia/Ashkenazy and the RPO/Davis too , also the experimental stereo Klemperer .

[LeMartinPecheur]

C Kleiber's VPO 7 would be a safe and excellent choice though.

Um, 'safe'? There is the little issue of CK, like EK, taking an 'interesting and unusual' decision re pizzicato at the close of the Allegretto!

And 'excellent'? There might be a case of 'transferred epithet' here. The VPO 5th is certainly excellent, ergo the 7th with the same band must obviously be too. Um, I'm not convinced, and have a very discerning mate wot would tell us very forcibly that this 7th is ordinary at best.

As it's certainly a good bit better than I could manage I don't rush to agree, but it certainly hasn't hit me the way the 5th does.

Retires rapidly behind sofa - clearly I'm an abject heretic, cast out from the body of the church!

[pastoralguy]

"Modern" as in "dating from 1813?

A pretty poor conductor - if he'd took as much care with Ludder's metronome markings, it wouldn't take much longer than about 8mins 30secs with all repeats. (8min 13sec in the wonderfully lithe Krivine recording.)

Well, the 'poor' conductor was very known for his interest in Czech music and was a leading light in the rediscovery of Janacek. (As well as G&S!) Ring any bells?

The length of the movement can be lengthened by repeating the trio's repeats on each of its appearances. Joseph Krips and the LSO dispatch the movement in 7' 25" whereas Sir Colin Davies in the 1990s with the Staatskapelle Dresden takes 10' 30". Their tempi are not that much different.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Last on 2 October 1999; 14+ years ago.

But according to Presto website, the work was reviewed in BaL in October 2007.

[cincinnatus]

But according to Presto website, the work was reviewed in BaL in October 2007.

I think you will find it was Beethoven's 5th Symphony in 2007 with the dg recording of Kleiber and the VPO the recommended version - thus the confusion?

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Yes, I can see that. Thank you.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Well, the 'poor' conductor was very known for his interest in Czech music and was a leading light in the rediscovery of Janacek. (As well as G&S!) Ring any bells?

Quasimodo?
Your friend in the orchestra must have been indulging in a little corroborative detail, intending to give artistic verisimilitude to an otherwise bald and unconvincing narrative. Following Beethoven's metronome markings, even with generous repeats won't make the Movement last quarter of an hour.

The length of the movement can be lengthened by repeating the trio's repeats on each of its appearances. Joseph Krips and the LSO dispatch the movement in 7' 25" whereas Sir Colin Davies in the 1990s with the Staatskapelle Dresden takes 10' 30". Their tempi are not that much different.

So, does Davis "repeat the Trio's repeats on each of its reappearances"? No such repeats are marked in my edition of the score; do you happen to know what the origins of these repeats are?

[Barbirollians]

Um, 'safe'? There is the little issue of CK, like EK, taking an 'interesting and unusual' decision re pizzicato at the close of the Allegretto!

And 'excellent'? There might be a case of 'transferred epithet' here. The VPO 5th is certainly excellent, ergo the 7th with the same band must obviously be too. Um, I'm not convinced, and have a very discerning mate wot would tell us very forcibly that this 7th is ordinary at best.

As it's certainly a good bit better than I could manage I don't rush to agree, but it certainly hasn't hit me the way the 5th does.

Retires rapidly behind sofa - clearly I'm an abject heretic, cast out from the body of the church!

Safe simply in the sense that it is a renowned recording and Deathridge chose C Kleiber's Pastoral . I also see it won in 1999 .

I cannot comment on your friend's views other than I got to know the splendid C Kleiber 7th before the 5th through a DG Signature LP in the 1980s - the Fifth always seemed very expensive uncoupled and at full price until the Originals came along.

I would not be surprised if he chose the 1982 Orfeo C Kleiber as that is thrilling too and a much better recording than the winning Pastoral.

[Petrushka]

I bought the Carlos Kleiber LP the month it came out (June 1977) and it's splendid, even more so in the CD coupling with that famous 5th. The VPO horns and timps give it terrific thrusting momentum and it would be my clear first choice. Listen to the VPO horns in full cry almost at the symphony's end to hear why. Of other versions I rate Konwitschny and the Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra which runs the Kleiber very close indeed. Any version that has the horns buried in the general welter of sound at the end is a non-starter in my view.

Really, though, unless Deathridge immediately chooses the Kleiber and proceeds to show why, he has set himself an impossible task.

[richardfinegold]

I bought the Carlos Kleiber LP the month it came out (June 1977) and it's splendid, even more so in the CD coupling with that famous 5th. The VPO horns and timps give it terrific thrusting momentum and it would be my clear first choice. Listen to the VPO horns in full cry almost at the symphony's end to hear why. Of other versions I rate Konwitschny and the Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra which runs the Kleiber very close indeed. Any version that has the horns buried in the general welter of sound at the end is a non-starter in my view.

Really, though, unless Deathridge immediately chooses the Kleiber and proceeds to show why, he has set himself an impossible task.

Pet, you really owe it to yourself to hear the Solti/Chicago SO mid 1970s. The horns at the end will leave you breathless, and the whole interpretation seems to perfect. It would be better known if the rest of that cycle was as distinguished, which was not the case.

[BBMmk2]

All done already it seems by us boarders!! I must get this Klieber recording! Sacrelidge that I hav'nt already(or have I?)

[Thropplenoggin]

All done already it seems by us boarders!! I must get this Klieber recording! Sacrelidge that I hav'nt already(or have I?)

A gnomic utterance worthy of Heraclitus.

[Richard Tarleton]

I bought the Carlos Kleiber LP the month it came out (June 1977) and it's splendid

Pet, and BBM, anyone who ever subscribed to Britannia Records (as I'm sure you didn't, but I did, briefly ) will probably have acquired this (and Kleiber Brahms 4, HvK Mahler 5.....) as part of their introductory 5 LPs for £1 introductory offer.....Fairly soon you came to realise that their catalogue varied little from month to month...then they sent you scratched records, or records you hadn't ordered...

[Petrushka]

Pet, and BBM, anyone who ever subscribed to Britannia Records (as I'm sure you didn't, but I did, briefly ) will probably have acquired this (and Kleiber Brahms 4, HvK Mahler 5.....) as part of their introductory 5 LPs for £1 introductory offer.....Fairly soon you came to realise that their catalogue varied little from month to month...then they sent you scratched records, or records you hadn't ordered...

I joined Britannia solely in order to get the introductory offer of the Solti Ring on CD for £20 and never regretted it. Mind, I did also get the CDs never ordered etc. No, the Carlos Kleiber LvB 7 came from a Manchester record shop, June 12 1977, where I went to spend that year's birthday money. Never regretted that either.

[Barbirollians]

Gibbs?

Their basement does not ever appear to have been occupied again since they closed down .