BaL 29.06.13 - Shostakovich Symphony. No. 5

[Nick Armstrong]

I think it took me a week to figure out how to get it open!! But, well worth the effort! It is now my No. 1

I am very jealous of you and IGI !

There's an interesting debate about the Aulos remastering here:

http://rec.music.classical.recordings.narkive.com/pY1tu8gF/aulos-remastering-of-kondrashin-s-shostakovich-recordings

Do we (you!) know if the currently-available Melodiya box contains the same remasterings, or their own? Musicweb's review suggests that Melodiya just repackaged the remastered versions (adding an extra disc)....

[Bryn]

O.k., so I have many more recordings of this symphony than I care to count, but I keep going back to the Ancerl, the Mark Wigglesworth and, of course, Kondrashin. Mravisnsky gets the occasional look in (various recordings). I have the Vienna/Jansons (in the box) but would not count it with those already mentioned. Bernstein in Japan (DVD) is also quite special.

[jayne lee wilson]

Ah, that Aulos set of Kondrashin and his Moscow band reminds me of the heady days of the Radio 3 messageboard. It was recommended to us by good old Ron Dough, the Laird of Carnoustie, and oliver sudden. I recall receiving the set - bought from Japan - and taking an age to work out how to open the box! Utterly thrilling playing and an excellent remastering job. I've yet to hear the Melodiya reissue, but wonder if their engineers did as fine a job in cleaning up the original masters?

Time to confess - I know, I'm terrible - I have both the Aulos and the Melodiya remasters and no, they're not identical. They're both superb, but the Melodiya is at a slightly higher level and there is often more tape noise audible; this benefits dynamics sometimes, but the more warts-and-all presentation does lead to some shrillness on flutes and piccolos, occasional fierceness on upper strings etc. The Aulos, possibly due to the DSD remastering, sounds "quieter" in level but also in tonal balance, a little smoother and more refined. The differences are more evident in the closer balances e.g. No.9, less so in say, No.10 - but in the 10th's allegretto some listeners might find the flute/piccolo shrillness a bit excessive.

I think I bought the Melodiya first and was thrilled with it - it's worlds away from those original BMGs. Not sure why I chased up the Aulos - probably after being impressed with their 1965/6 Svetlanov Tchaikovsky and the Taneyevs' DSCH Quartets (in a huge, beautiful blue box).

(**Didn't Karafan once confess to having both DSCH Kondrashin remasters...? Or someone else..?)

[visualnickmos]

This is odd. I noticed that the podcast hadn't been released yesterday evening, but I did successfully access the correct episode of CD Review on iPlayer (though this was via my Sony Blu-ray player).

Geoffrey Norris offered a very 'safe' recommendation, i.e. nothing to frighten the horses. If, heaven forfend, you could only have one DSCH5 on your shelves, it would serve reasonably well, but I wouldn't be without Kondrashin, Mravinsky, Bernstein, Gergiev or Kreizberg (who didn't merit a mention, unless I missed it).

It is indeed, very odd. I have just tried again - and you've guessed it - it is STILL last weeks programme that comes out of my speakers! How can this be??????

[Nick Armstrong]

Time to confess - I know, I'm terrible - I have both the Aulos and the Melodiya remasters and no, they're not identical

Blimey Jayne!!


Thank you for your confession! ...that answers my question perfectly! I think I want the Aulos version. Which makes life rather complicated as it seems almost impossible to find!

[Il Grande Inquisitor]

Time to confess - I know, I'm terrible - I have both the Aulos and the Melodiya remasters and no, they're not identical. They're both superb, but the Melodiya is at a slightly higher level and there is often more tape noise audible; this benefits dynamics sometimes, but the more warts-and-all presentation does lead to some shrillness on flutes and piccolos, occasional fierceness on upper strings etc. The Aulos, possibly due to the DSD remastering, sounds "quieter" in level but also in tonal balance, a little smoother and more refined. The differences are more evident in the closer balances e.g. No.9, less so in say, No.10 - but in the 10th's allegretto some listeners might find the flute/piccolo shrillness a bit excessive.

I think I bought the Melodiya first and was thrilled with it - it's worlds away from those original BMGs. Not sure why I chased up the Aulos - probably after being impressed with their 1965/6 Svetlanov Tchaikovsky and the Taneyevs' DSCH Quartets (in a huge, beautiful blue box).

Thank you, jlw, just the post I'd been waiting for. Part of me had suspected that Melodiya had perhaps laid down a condition that in return for allowing Aulos access to the master tapes, they would have to share the remastered version. Apparently not. I think the cleaning up done by Aulos is excellent, particularly the oft-shredded sound for No.4.

Did Aulos remaster Kondrashin's recording of The Bells, or am I just imagining it?

[Karafan]

(**Didn't Karafan once confess to having both DSCH Kondrashin remasters...? Or someone else..?)

While guilty of innumerable pecuniary lapses Jayne, I am as white as the lamb on this one! I only have the Melodiya box (very good* and red in tooth and claw it is) I am afraid and never succumbed to the earlier BMG release or the Aulos. (*But that slipcase! I have bought chocolate eclairs in sturdier packaging ).

K.

[Il Grande Inquisitor]

I am very jealous of you and IGI !

If you wanted to sample the set, you can listen to the entire thing on RussianDVD's site. Click on the Preview button next to the cover image!

http://www.russiandvd.com/store/product.asp?sku=33905

[jayne lee wilson]

Blimey Jayne!!


Thank you for your confession! ...that answers my question perfectly! I think I want the Aulos version. Which makes life rather complicated as it seems almost impossible to find!

Yes, but please don't be put off acquiring the Melodiya Box (with its bizarre combination of fragile but quirkily illustrated box, and sturdy cream/black sleeves for each CD, each with a different Russian Artist's drawing or engraving), it is a lot better than faute de mieux! You'll find David Gutman's very positive review in Gramophone for 4/2007. It's likely to be the only high-quality access to these readings for any foreseeable future. Unless you listen at very high volumes on a bright system it should give a great deal more pleasure than offense.
(I've been scrutinising the differences through a very high-res Dac (details on request!) and the plus and minus of it won't be so apparent on all systems, or to all ears).

There is also a Venezia issue of Kondrashin's DSCH symphonies available from HMV Japan. On past experience it will be their own remaster, likely very good too - but I haven't heard it and can't find any comment.

A great benefit of the KK set is the swift reading of No.15, at just over 40' even swifter than Maxim Shostakovich's terrific Prague SO version (around 43'). It's a (very) useful corrective to the oft-praised Sanderling(s) (48'38 Berlin SO, 46'45 Berlin Phil), just about the only DSCH performances of his that I DON'T get on with!

Buy the Melodiya from Amazon, try out some of the fiercer movements and then...YOU decide!

[akiralx]

I remember thinking that my favourite VPO/Jansons will not even get a mention - I recall first listening to it thinking beforehand 'this will be fairly mediocre, can't be a patch on more famous recordings, the VPO can't really match Russian orchestras in this', and then being really impressed with it!

[Anna]

There is also a Venezia issue of Kondrashin's DSCH symphonies available from HMV Japan. On past experience it will be their own remaster, likely very good too - but I haven't heard it and can't find any comment.

The Venetia is the other boxed set that I have, it's 12 cds, the symphonies plus Concertos for violin and orch, No. 1 (Leonid Kogan 1962) and No. 2 (David Oistrakh 1968) and two versions of Babi Yar, one with Eisen (1967) and one with Gromadsky (1962).

I bought the Venetia before the Aulos, and to be honest haven't listened to it for years, would need to spin say the No. 4 (which IGI mentions above) from both to compare but from memory the Aulos is far superior. The booklet is in Russian so I cannot say when or where the remastering, if any, took place (possibly IGI may know more about it)

I'd go with jayne's suggestion (if the Aulos is truly unobtainable) and get the Melodiya if it's Kondrashin and a boxed set that you want rather than the BaL choice of Jansons (which I still have to catch on iplayer)

[BBMmk2]

A free program I would recommend is CCleaner. You can decide just what um, 'detritus' you want it to clean from you computer, including you browsing history. You might want to use its cookie cleaning facility with care though. Many cookies are worth keeping on board. Otherwise, whichever browser you are using should have an option among its tools to clear your browsing history.

It might not be the solution, but it's worth a try.

As ever Bryn thank you for your advice!

I must play the VPO/Jansons versio0n soon but the trouble is its the time and yes, I know, it's not term time either!

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

and yes, I know, it's not term time either!

It is where I live.

[BBMmk2]

It is where I live.

We broke up last Friday(posh school :))

[HighlandDougie]

(if the Aulos is truly unobtainable)

I also have to confess to having both the Melodiya and the Aulos. I also thought that the latter was - very frustratingly - unobtainable but I kept looking, especially on amazon.com. I eventually bought a second-hand copy (from a Korean marketplace seller) which I eventually gave up on as I got a message to say that they had discovered that the set wasn't complete and that they were going to try and obtain a new copy for me. "Ha, ha", I thought - and bought another copy from an American marketplace seller (also at a very reasonable price - the Korean set was just over $100). Of course, two days after I received the US set, a brand new sealed set arrived from Korea. I didn't pay duty on either (after a bit of legerdemain agreed with the US seller and French customs presumably couldn't be bothered with the latter). The spare set went to the most excellent of homes. JLW is spot-on in terms of the sound differences but there's not a lot in it and the Melodiya set is more than acceptable (and is infinitely better than its pretty crumbly Chant du Monde predecessor).