BaL 10.03.12 Vaughan Williams' Symphony no. 4 in F minor

[aka Calum Da Jazbo]

Another excellent BaL today, I thought:

absolutely agree a much appreciated introduction to this masterpiece for me .... many thanks to Mr Burton-Page fro making the work the highlight and putting the emphasis on its intense and dark essence ....

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

... but, compared with Previn's readings of the other Symphonies in his set, it doesn't quite match that level of insight and communication. And this is surprising in that, of all the RVW Symphonies, the Fourth would seem to be the most closely "akin" to Previn's personality in the late '60s - and yet the Third and Fifth (works of a very different "character") receive performances unsurpassed since.

Yes. that was what I meant.

[umslopogaas]

#24 verismissimo, ah, so it does. I overlooked it. Its a great photo.

[rank_and_file]

As has been said, an interesting and enjoyable Bal from Piers Burton-Page.

For some years I have had the Handley/RLPO version, and have heard the work live twice I think. Which brings me to my gripe: again the use of the accursed Optimod frequency compression produces a bland bleached compressed thin sound. A number of points Burton Page made were hardly audible.

Immediately after the Berglund finale was played, I switched to my Handley CD and played the last movement. So far as the sound with the CD frequency range was concerned what my ears heard was absolutely fabulous, airy and dynamic, and the final hammer-blow was as it should be: a brutal sickening thud - that thud probably 5 times louder than the level which come through on the Radio 3 broadcast level.

I remember listening in my bath (!) to CD review many years ago when Nicolas Kenyon or his predecessor was asked by a listener why the Optimod compression system had been introduced. He said it was only for drive-time programmes and illustrated the reason for its use if listening in a car to quiet passages against tyre noise when the quiet passage had to be artificially raised, and vice versa for loud passages. Then I remember him saying that there was NO intention to use it on other programmes, especially concerts. Dream on.

Unless anyone can advise me to the contrary, I am sure the Optimod system is on 24 hours a day.

I am lucky living near London so can go to concerts easily to hear what the music is really like, and certainly Vaughan Williams’ 4th is a symphony to be heard live to experience its real impact.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Immediately after the Berglund finale was played, I switched to my Handley CD and played the last movement. So far as the sound with the CD frequency range was concerned what my ears heard was absolutely fabulous, airy and dynamic, and the final hammer-blow was as it should be: a brutal sickening thud - that thud probably 5 times louder than the level which come through on the Radio 3 broadcast level.

[BBMmk2]

The Sir Andrew Davis version didnt come anywhere then? I have Handleys RLPO, which would be a hard nut to crack,imo.

[Pabmusic]

I've only just finished listening to the BAL on iPlayer. Have I got it right? The choice was Berglund/RPO (not the Previn, as some seem to think). I thought it was a well reasoned review, though I must listen to the Handley to see if he really lets the tension slacken in the last movement - for that's the only reason that recording wasn't picked.

[BBMmk2]

I've only just finished listening to the BAL on iPlayer. Have I got it right? The choice was Berglund/RPO (not the Previn, as some seem to think). I thought it was a well reasoned review, though I must listen to the Handley to see if he really lets the tension slacken in the last movement - for that's the only reason that recording wasn't picked.

That's very surprising! I have the A Davis, Handley and Previn VW4th. Will listen today!

[Nick Armstrong]

Can't, alas, oblige with "a long list", but this might give a glimpse of what might have been:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pEwhe-3GXU

Absolutely extraordinary! Who would have thought it?!

[Nick Armstrong]

certainly Vaughan Williams’ 4th is a symphony to be heard live to experience its real impact.

Totally agreed. Not a piece I feel called on to listen to at home much. I've heard it a couple of times live and it's overwhelming. I find i only have the early Boult and the Slatkin - good to hear the latter getting a good shout, in what I agree was a very interesting BAL. Berglund sounded terrific but I'm not tempted to rush out and get it.

[jayne lee wilson]

Rank and file -
May seem a bit late in the day to mention it, but you can avoid FM optimod compression altogether by listening to the R3 HDs stream at 320 kbps, available through iTunes (excellent stability) or the R3 homepage (this latter sometimes less reliably...) As someone who loves a wide dynamic range I recommend it strongly.

By the way, don't overlook the Paul Daniel/BSO 4th, it's very well played and recorded and comes with lovely couplings, Flos Campi & Norfolk Rhapsody no.1.

As has been said, an interesting and enjoyable Bal from Piers Burton-Page.

For some years I have had the Handley/RLPO version, and have heard the work live twice I think. Which brings me to my gripe: again the use of the accursed Optimod frequency compression produces a bland bleached compressed thin sound. A number of points Burton Page made were hardly audible.

Immediately after the Berglund finale was played, I switched to my Handley CD and played the last movement. So far as the sound with the CD frequency range was concerned what my ears heard was absolutely fabulous, airy and dynamic, and the final hammer-blow was as it should be: a brutal sickening thud - that thud probably 5 times louder than the level which come through on the Radio 3 broadcast level.

I remember listening in my bath (!) to CD review many years ago when Nicolas Kenyon or his predecessor was asked by a listener why the Optimod compression system had been introduced. He said it was only for drive-time programmes and illustrated the reason for its use if listening in a car to quiet passages against tyre noise when the quiet passage had to be artificially raised, and vice versa for loud passages. Then I remember him saying that there was NO intention to use it on other programmes, especially concerts. Dream on.

Unless anyone can advise me to the contrary, I am sure the Optimod system is on 24 hours a day.

I am lucky living near London so can go to concerts easily to hear what the music is really like, and certainly Vaughan Williams’ 4th is a symphony to be heard live to experience its real impact.

[Alf-Prufrock]

Rank and file -
May seem a bit late in the day to mention it, but you can avoid FM optimod compression altogether by listening to the R3 HDs stream at 320 kbps, available through iTunes (excellent stability) or the R3 homepage (this latter sometimes less reliably...) As someone who loves a wide dynamic range I recommend it strongly.

One of these days I will have to buy a second computer to go with my expensive hi-fi so that I can link the HD stream with my equipment. The computer will have to be quiet though, not something I've witnessed satisfactorily yet. Or does anyone know an easy cheapo fix for doing this? Is a computer entirely necessary?

On topic, I had not heard the Daniel version before and at its price I think I may accommodate his version on my shelves, groaning though they may be.

[jayne lee wilson]

I think you can do it with a Squeezebox, perhaps users can advise. But the main thing with any computer-generated music is to feed the digital signal (either Optical or USB) out to a DAC for the best sound. Don't use the computer's analogue output as you won't hear the stream at anything like its best. Having owned or heard high-end FM Tuners from Troughlines to Magnum Dynalabs, I can say that given the dynamic restrictions currently (and probably permanently) on FM the HDs stream is now the way to go.

One of these days I will have to buy a second computer to go with my expensive hi-fi so that I can link the HD stream with my equipment. The computer will have to be quiet though, not something I've witnessed satisfactorily yet. Or does anyone know an easy cheapo fix for doing this? Is a computer entirely necessary?

On topic, I had not heard the Daniel version before and at its price I think I may accommodate his version on my shelves, groaning though they may be.

[Parry1912]

It's a shame that we don't seem to have an audio thread. It would be useful to have some of these hardware-based discussions that appear occasionally on various threads in one place. (I think the only thing I miss about Gramophone compared to IRR is the Audio pages.)

I think you can do it with a Squeezebox, perhaps users can advise. But the main thing with any computer-generated music is to feed the digital signal (either Optical or USB) out to a DAC for the best sound. Don't use the computer's analogue output as you won't hear the stream at anything like its best. Having owned or heard high-end FM Tuners from Troughlines to Magnum Dynalabs, I can say that given the dynamic restrictions currently (and probably permanently) on FM the HDs stream is now the way to go.

[VodkaDilc]

It's a shame that we don't seem to have an audio thread. It would be useful to have some of these hardware-based discussions that appear occasionally on various threads in one place. (I think the only thing I miss about Gramophone compared to IRR is the Audio pages.)

I recall that the early issues of IRR had audio features contributed by the much-missed writers from the old Gramophone, like Ivor Humphreys and Geoffrey Horn.