BaL 8.07.23 - Stravinsky: Petrushka

**Petrushka** · 27-06-23, 13:39

I rather wish I hadn't accepted this challenge once I noticed the number of available versions but after several days it's here!

I've decided not to include any 'Petrushka Suite' recordings because I doubt if it will figure in the BaL programme and, surprisingly, there are so many versions I'd still be dong the list at Christmas. The same applies to the Three Pieces for piano. I've also decided against including any transcriptions (the four hands version for piano and others for organ and accordions) on the grounds that the sheer number available will make the listing much too long and would take forever to do.

The decision not to split the list between available versions of the 1911 and 1947 scores is a bit more problematic and one I regret so apologise if anyone wanted it. Many recordings do say which one is used but some don't. Sometimes it's even difficult to tell if it's the complete ballet or the suite that's been recorded! In one case (the Mackerras) it's difficult to tell which orchestra is playing - perhaps someone can clear that one up. Sorry but it's already taken me several days and I'm in awe of EA doing this every week!

**Pulcinella** · 27-06-23, 14:07

Originally posted by Petrushka View Post

I rather wish I hadn't accepted this challenge once I noticed the number of available versions but after several days it's here!

I've decided not to include any 'Petrushka Suite' recordings because I doubt if it will figure in the BaL programme and, surprisingly, there are so many versions I'd still be dong the list at Christmas. The same applies to the Three Pieces for piano. I've also decided against including any transcriptions (the four hands version for piano and others for organ and accordions) on the grounds that the sheer number available will make the listing much too long and would take forever to do.

The decision not to split the list between available versions of the 1911 and 1947 scores is a bit more problematic and one I regret so apologise if anyone wanted it. Many recordings do say which one is used but some don't. Sometimes it's even difficult to tell if it's the complete ballet or the suite that's been recorded! In one case (the Mackerras) it's difficult to tell which orchestra is playing - perhaps someone can clear that one up. Sorry but it's already taken me several days and I'm in awe of EA doing this every week!

Heartiest congratulations: I did wonder if Alpie might delegate this to you!

I certainly agree about it being difficult to distinguish between 1911 and 1947 versions from Presto's listings (and from the CD liner notes themselves in some cases).
But I was able to identify these, so here's the start of a breakdown for those that are interested.
Happy to add others if other members have recordings that are identified/identifiable as one or the other (and it's considered generally worth doing).
This is not in any way a criticism or undermining of our member Petrushka's sterling efforts.

1911

Suisse Romande Orchestra/Ernest Ansermet
Cleveland Orchestra/Pierre Boulez
New York Philharmonic Orchestra/Pierre Boulez
London Symphony Orchestra/Charles Dutoit
Montreal Symphony Orchestra/Charles Dutoit
Maryinski Orchestra/Valery Gergiev
London Philharmonic Orchestra/Bernard Haitink
Philharmonia Orchestra/Eliahu Inbal
Suisse Romande Orchestra/Neeme Jarvi
Bergen Philharmonic Orchestra/Andrew Litton
Wiener Philharmoniker, Lorin Maazel
London Symphony Orchestra/Sir Charles Mackerras
Boston Symphony Orchestra/Pierre Monteux
Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra/Vassily Petrenko
Les Siecles/François-Xavier Roth
Philadelphia Orchestra/Leopold Stokowski

1947

London Symphony Orchestra/Claudio Abbado (mislabelled as 1911, according to Wiki)
Czech Philharmonic Orchestra/Karel Ancerl
New York Philharmonic Orchestra/Leonard Bernstein
Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra/Riccardo Chailly
Philharmonia Orchestra/Robert Craft
Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra/Sir Colin Davis
Detroit Symphony Orchestra/Antal Dorati
Minneapolis Symphony Orchestra/Antal Dorati
Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra/Maris Jansons
Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra/Yevgeny Mravinsky
Philadelphia Orchestra/Riccardo Muti
Boston Symphony Orchestra/Seiji Ozawa (1970 and 1999)
City of Birmingham Symphony Orchestra/Sir Simon Rattle
London Symphony Orchestra/Sir Simon Rattle
Philharmonia Orchestra/Esa-Pekka Salonen
Columbia Symphony Orchestra/Igor Stravinsky
London Philharmonic Orchestra/Klaus Tennstedt

**Pulcinella** · 27-06-23, 14:15

Originally posted by Petrushka View Post

I rather wish I hadn't accepted this challenge once I noticed the number of available versions but after several days it's here!

I've decided not to include any 'Petrushka Suite' recordings because I doubt if it will figure in the BaL programme and, surprisingly, there are so many versions I'd still be dong the list at Christmas. The same applies to the Three Pieces for piano. I've also decided against including any transcriptions (the four hands version for piano and others for organ and accordions) on the grounds that the sheer number available will make the listing much too long and would take forever to do.

The decision not to split the list between available versions of the 1911 and 1947 scores is a bit more problematic and one I regret so apologise if anyone wanted it. Many recordings do say which one is used but some don't. Sometimes it's even difficult to tell if it's the complete ballet or the suite that's been recorded! In one case (the Mackerras) it's difficult to tell which orchestra is playing - perhaps someone can clear that one up. Sorry but it's already taken me several days and I'm in awe of EA doing this every week!

The Mackerras is with the LSO and it's the 1911 version so added to that list!

Just a moment...

https://www.discogs.com/release/7521446-Igor-Stravinsky-London-Symphony-Orchestra-Charles-Mackerras-Petrouchka-1911-Version-Complete

**Alain Maréchal** · 27-06-23, 14:39

One simplification: Ansermet claimed that he never performed the revised versions of any IS ballets, so he is unlikely to have recorded it.
One complication: Ansermet recorded it three times, twice in mono (LPO,OSR) once in stereo (OSR), and they were all available a few years ago.

**Petrushka** · 27-06-23, 15:46

Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post

The Mackerras is with the LSO and it's the 1911 version so added to that list!

https://www.discogs.com/release/7521...rsion-Complete

Duly amended, thanks.

I also wondered whether the two Fricsay recordings listed are, in fact, one and the same?

**Petrushka** · 27-06-23, 15:53

Originally posted by Pulcinella View Post

Heartiest congratulations: I did wonder if Alpie might delegate this to you!

I certainly agree about it being difficult to distinguish between 1911 and 1947 versions from Presto's listings (and from the CD liner notes themselves in some cases).
But I was able to identify these, so here's the start of a breakdown for those that are interested.
Happy to add others if other members have recordings that are identified/identifiable as one or the other (and it's considered generally worth doing).
This is not in any way a criticism or undermining of our member Petrushka's sterling efforts.

1911

Cleveland Orchestra/Pierre Boulez
New York Philharmonic Orchestra/Pierre Boulez
Maryinski Orchestra/Valery Gergiev
London Philharmonic Orchestra/Bernard Haitink
London Symphony Orchestra/Sir Charles Mackerras
Royal Liverpool Philharmonic Orchestra/Vassily Petrenko
Les Siecles/François-Xavier Roth

1947

Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra/Riccardo Chailly
Detroit Symphony Orchestra/Antal Dorati
Philadelphia Orchestra/Riccardo Muti
City of Birmingham Symphony Orchestra/Sir Simon Rattle
Philharmonia Orchestra/Esa-Pekka Salonen
Columbia Symphony Orchestra/Igor Stravinsky
London Philharmonic Orchestra/Klaus Tennstedt

Just to highlight the problem. Stravinsky's own recording with the Columbia Symphony Orchestra has variously been attributed to 1911, 1947, as neither or an amalgam of both!

**Pulcinella** · 27-06-23, 16:11

Originally posted by Petrushka View Post

Just to highlight the problem. Stravinsky's own recording with the Columbia Symphony Orchestra has variously been attributed to 1911, 1947, as neither or an amalgam of both!

Yes: pinches of salt required.
I should probably be able to spot the difference(s) myself, though I have only a 1947 score.
The big Sony Stravinsky box documentation lists it as 1947.

The Wiki article gives the different instrumentations of the two versions and also lists some notable recordings (with version, including a note of a misattribution!); I'll update the version list from it later, but with a 'Reader beware' warning!

Petrushka (ballet) - Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrushka_(ballet)

**HighlandDougie** · 27-06-23, 16:29

Originally posted by Petrushka View Post

Duly amended, thanks.

I also wondered whether the two Fricsay recordings listed are, in fact, one and the same?

Yes - The Rundfunk in Amerikanischen Sector (RIAS) Orchestra has morphed over the years into the Deutsches Symphonie-Orchester. An addition to the list (if still available) is Sylvain Cambreling with the SWR Sinfonieorchester Baden-Baden und Freiburg (now, from memory, merged with the Stuttgart-based SWR orchestra). I have the CD but, although I can't be 100% certain without a listen, 95% certain it's the 1911 version. Coupled with Debussy Prélude à l'Aprés-midi ... and my favourite version (in slightly truncated form) of the Florent Schmitt 'Tragédie de Salomé'. And churlish of me not to record my deep admiration of Petrushka for his herculean efforts.

**RichardB** · 27-06-23, 16:46

Not seeing a recording on the list conducted by MTT I searched around on Qobuz to see if there is one, and no there isn't. But he must have recorded it surely. Nor do they list one by Michael Gielen. So which was the recording I listened to a couple of months ago that I really liked??? Damn.

**Pulcinella** · 27-06-23, 16:56

I've just ordered a copy of the 1911 score: Dover Edition (much cheaper than B&H).

Amazon.co.uk

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Petrushka-Full-Score-Original-Version/dp/0486256804/ref=sr_1_1?crid=RMDBQ3HK7ZV&keywords=Petrushka+score&qid=1687884713&s=books&sprefix=petrushka+score%2Cstripbooks%2C64&sr=1-1

**HighlandDougie** · 27-06-23, 17:12

Originally posted by RichardB View Post

Not seeing a recording on the list conducted by MTT I searched around on Qobuz to see if there is one, and no there isn't. But he must have recorded it surely. Nor do they list one by Michael Gielen. So which was the recording I listened to a couple of months ago that I really liked??? Damn.

Try this: https://www.discogs.com/fr/release/5...C3%80-La-Russe

No Gielen though - did he conduct it?

**Bryn** · 27-06-23, 17:13

Originally posted by RichardB View Post

Not seeing a recording on the list conducted by MTT I searched around on Qobuz to see if there is one, and no there isn't. But he must have recorded it surely. Nor do they list one by Michael Gielen. So which was the recording I listened to a couple of months ago that I really liked??? Damn.

MTT did record it but it's out of the catalogue at the moment but there is this:

(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UejsGZJQrmc)

I can find no sign of a Gielen recording.

**RichardB** · 27-06-23, 19:36

Originally posted by HighlandDougie View Post

No Gielen though - did he conduct it?

His released Stravinsky recordings are mostly of much later works, apart from Zvezdoliki, but surely he must have conducted the three most famous ballets at some point. I still haven't worked out which (possibly quite recent) recording of Pet I found myself liking recently. Maybe it was Roth.

**EnemyoftheStoat** · 28-06-23, 10:09

A few of each on my shelves:

1911
Cleveland Orchestra/Pierre Boulez
Philharmonia Orchestra/Eliahu Inbal
Bergen Philharmonic Orchestra/Andrew Litton
1947
Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra/Maris Jansons
Leningrad Philharmonic Orchestra/Yevgeny Mravinsky
City of Birmingham Symphony Orchestra/Sir Simon Rattle

There may be others lurking, coupled with things earlier in the A-Z run or in conductor boxes; either way, I'm not on the lookout for any more unless they turn up as Oxfam unmissables.

BaL 8.07.23 - Stravinsky: Petrushka

BaL 8.07.23 - Stravinsky: Petrushka

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