BaL 12.06.21 - Orff: Carmina Burana

[cloughie]

Whom you can always tell from their gait.

Particularly after one or two in the Midnight Hour.

[Petrushka]

Alpie, you haven’t included Norman Lebrecht’s mythical Karajan version.

Karajan performed the work 16 times between 1941 and 1953 and a recording was touted towards the end of Karajan's life but was never made.

The first time I ever heard the piece was the famous LSO/Previn 1974 Prom. I dashed down to the shops the next day during my lunch hour and bought the Frühbeck de Burgos recording and promptly played it to death. These days I hardly ever listen to it but it's still a delightful romp whenever I do. The only versions I have are the Frühbeck, the Deutsches Oper/Jochum, BPO/Rattle and, of course, the LSO/Previn.

[Parry1912]

... and, of course, the LSO/Previn.

My old school’s choir is on that one. I was at the school at the time but sadly wasn’t interested in such things then That and the fact that I can’t sing

[ardcarp]

Marmite indeed. But leaving aside Orff himself (and we shouldn't judge composers' works by their views) Carmina is a truly original work with all that ostinato stuff and inspiring orchestration. Groups I have been involved with (both singing and providing a celesta!) have absolutely loved the work for its vigour. The same goes for audiences, so you won't see me dissing it. Jeremy Summerly will, hopefully, take charge of the BAL slot and not be too distracted by 'chat' format. I do hope his judgements will favour recordings with éclat, and not just textural precision.

[gradus]

The Frühbeck de Burgos recording is a remarkable performance blessed by Lucia Popp in fine voice but the digital transfer I've heard is over-bright and not as good as the analogue original imv.

[rauschwerk]

Inspires by a fellow pupil's performance of Estuans interius in a school music competition in the early 1960s, I at once borrowed the Ormandy version from the library. I had no idea what the piece was about until I heard Frühbeck de Burgos do it at the RFH (same forces as his recording, except that Margaret Price was the solo soprano). The Ormandy version has Harve Presnell as the baritone soloist, and he tackles Ego sum abbas Cucaniensis with lip-smacking relish. I once had the Previn on LP but I seem to remember some untidy corners which put me off it. These days I usually turn to Blomstedt, but other Orff pieces interest me more.

[gurnemanz]

I'll listen out of curiosity. It's not a work I need to listen to often, but I don't dislike it, as some do. About 50 years ago as a student I got a cheapo Heliodor LP with Herbert Kegel in a performance which I recently acquired coincidentally on a Kegel CD box. I should get around to listening to it some time for old time's sake. Aged about 20 I saw a staged and choreographed performance in Nürnberg (appropriate location?) which I remember enjoying at the time. Also, our choir had fun singing it a few years ago.

[visualnickmos]

Marmite indeed. But leaving aside Orff himself (and we shouldn't judge composers' works by their views) Carmina is a truly original work with all that ostinato stuff and inspiring orchestration. Groups I have been involved with (both singing and providing a celesta!) have absolutely loved the work for its vigour. The same goes for audiences, so you won't see me dissing it. Jeremy Summerly will, hopefully, take charge of the BAL slot and not be too distracted by 'chat' format. I do hope his judgements will favour recordings with éclat, and not just textural precision.

Spot on. A work I don't spin often, but boy, o boy, when I do - I DO! Of my few versions, I find Jochum's DG 'composer-approved' the least interesting. A bit staid and stodgy. I am looking forward to this BaL.

[AuntDaisy]

Given the DG's history, should the focus be on Carmina Burana's impact on advertising? It might add a little (old) spice to BaL.

A side note, the Calig CDs also have Catulli Carmina & Dithyrambi. Do these works divide opinion as well?

[LMcD]

I'll listen out of curiosity. It's not a work I need to listen to often, but I don't dislike it, as some do. About 50 years ago as a student I got a cheapo Heliodor LP with Herbert Kegel in a performance which I recently acquired coincidentally on a Kegel CD box. I should get around to listening to it some time for old time's sake. Aged about 20 I saw a staged and choreographed performance in Nürnberg (appropriate location?) which I remember enjoying at the time. Also, our choir had fun singing it a few years ago.

Same here! I have LSO/Hickox.

[Ein Heldenleben]

Isn’t it an unusual example of a piece of classical music recognised by millions of non classical music fans but , for varying reasons , disliked even sneered at by a lot of aficionados? And all because of the Old Spice advert ? Is O Fortuna that bad a piece of music ? Or has it palled because of the constant repetition ?

[AuntDaisy]

Isn’t it an unusual example of a piece of classical music recognised by millions of non classical music fans but , for varying reasons , disliked even sneered at by a lot of aficionados? And all because of the Old Spice advert ? Is O Fortuna that bad a piece of music ? Or has it palled because of the constant repetition ?

I think you're right about the constant repetition - it's a lively, joyous piece; almost Janacek-ian.
Listening to Jochum's DG composer-authorized CD at the moment - mainly for Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau & because visualnickmos is probably right.
I've dug out David Parlett's Penguin book (courtesy of Oxfam) to help with the text (having small Latin & less Greek, I'm afraid).

[Ein Heldenleben]

I think you're right about the constant repetition - it's a lively, joyous piece; almost Janacek-ian.
Listening to Jochum's DG composer-authorized CD at the moment - mainly for Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau & because visualnickmos is probably right.
I've dug out David Parlett's Penguin book (courtesy of Oxfam) to help with the text (having small Latin & less Greek, I'm afraid).

Is my memory playing tricks or was there a South Bank Show film of the Carmina complete with Dietrich F-D dressed as a stuffed swan and rotating slowly on a spit? Or was it another unfortunate Bass-Baritone?

[rauschwerk]

Isn’t it an unusual example of a piece of classical music recognised by millions of non classical music fans but , for varying reasons , disliked even sneered at by a lot of aficionados? And all because of the Old Spice advert ? Is O Fortuna that bad a piece of music ? Or has it palled because of the constant repetition ?

I think that any sneering came well before the Old Spice ad, which surely dates from the 1970s. By this time there were a good few recordings of the piece. At a time (early 60s) when enthusiasm for the avant-garde was probably at its height, here was a piece, rapidly becoming popular, with no intellectual pretensions whatever!

[Ein Heldenleben]

I think that any sneering came well before the Old Spice ad, which surely dates from the 1970s. By this time there were a good few recordings of the piece. At a time (early 60s) when enthusiasm for the avant-garde was probably at its height, here was a piece, rapidly becoming popular, with no intellectual pretensions whatever!

Another example for John Carey’s book - The Intellectuals and The Masses . To which one could also add John Rutter’s oeuvre and Karl Jenkins Armed Man.