BaL 1.06.19 - Mendelssohn: Symphony no. 4 "Italian"

[cloughie]

Decca

Coupled with a very good Scottish!

[jayne lee wilson]

God how wonderful was that....I think I've just heard the one that should win....my winner anyway.....laters....

[edashtav]

Jayne Lee Wilson... in your recent review of the Philharmonia / Sinopoli CD
you were somewhat dismissive of its outer movements and used the phrase " the tempi are very steady".

The musicologist José Bowen has studied contemporary comments re Mendelssohn's conducting. He reaches this tentative conclusion:

"Mendelssohn liked his tempos quick and steady. Schumann called his
rapidity in the Beethoven Ninth "unprecedented." And while Wagner's
repeated assurances that Mendelssohn's tempi were too fast may be suspect,
there is enough confirmation from Berlioz, Bülow , Joachim, and numerous
other reviewers to accept this opinion as true."

I suspect that you are as one with Felix over preferring fast tempi, but are you happy to be at variance over steadiness, I wonder?

[jayne lee wilson]

Well Ed., Mendelssohn's 4th has been gracing our world for nearly two centuries now; surely it isn't too much to suggest that, through subtle dynamic, tempo and phrasal inflexion, responsive to each mood and shade of emotion the music seems to express (and allowing for variation in the performers' perception of such) we find new ways to bring it to life?
(This is one reason why Holliger's recording of the later revision is so enjoyable - you hear the familiar in a new light...)

Anyway, I would have thought that a subtle natural rubato need not be out of place in a performance which takes a generally steady approach... or is that too much of a contradiction? I don't think it is.
(One could also conceive of a steady-state recording rather more eventful, or expressive, than Sinopoli's...)

More detailed comments on recent recordings very shortly... (including my winner!)....

[gurnemanz]

No mention on the playlist of another recent chamber orchestra version from BR Klassik/Sony, issued in 2015. The Münchner Kammerorchester under Alexander Liebreich couple the Italian with the Midsummer Night's Dream incidental music. Just played on Spoty and found quite entrancing in beautiful slender transparent sound and with vivid contrast, eg in the darker moments of the Dream. Definitely now a favourite in both works. And, I note, on cheap offer at jpc and even cheaper at Amazon.de. Seems to have made more waves in Germany than here.

[Bryn]

Splashed out this afternoon on Bernstein and the IPO (coupled with items from the incidental music for A Midsummer Night's Dream with the SdBR, Kubelik). 20p from a local charity shop as one of 50 CDs for £10 (see soon to be posted message in Charity Shop Trawl thread).

[edashtav]

Well Ed., Mendelssohn's 4th has been gracing our world for nearly two centuries now; surely it isn't too much to suggest that, through subtle dynamic, tempo and phrasal inflexion, responsive to each mood and shade of emotion the music seems to express (and allowing for variation in the performers' perception of such) we find new ways to bring it to life?
(This is one reason why Holliger's recording of the later revision is so enjoyable - you hear the familiar in a new light...)





Anyway, I would have thought that a subtle natural rubato need not be out of place in a performance which takes a generally steady approach... or is that too much of a contradiction? I don't think it is.
(One could also conceive of a steady-state recording rather more eventful, or expressive, than Sinopoli's...)

More detailed comments on recent recordings very shortly... (including my winner!)....

Mmm... yes, but freshening up can mean losing meaning, Jayne. I seem to remember that Mendelssohn was somewhat critical of Chopin's rubato-fuelled pianism. His worry: Chopin's playing obscured works' structures, reducing them to mere fantasias.That's my worry about lack of steadiness in some conductors' interpretations of Mendelssohn. FMB was a Master and knew how to create satisfying structures. My motto? "Steady Eddy"
( Before you remind me that Mendelssohn's op. 28 was, originally, a fantasia, may I remind you that it 'grew' into a proper sonata which has plenty of rigorous form despite being based on Scottish tunes. Felix knew that his original was unsatisfactory, that it needed underpinning. The finished work is similar to Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata... containing some of the freedom of a fantasia, but well girded. Neither Felix nor Ludwig was enamoured of sloppiness.)

[jayne lee wilson]

The Freiburg Baroque/Heras-Casado (HM,2015 24/96 Qobuz-S) offers a seductive coloristic delicacy, and subtle, telling dynamic shifts to the attentive ear.
The period instruments themselves are an especial pleasure here, for their lovely timbre; you are aware of them as individuals yet always without any conductor-led indulgence of phrase. So a fairly straight, if rather contemplative, interpretation, beauty is truth, truth beauty….

The 1st movement begins in a very laidback style, but usefully strengthens through repeat and development, never too much too soon - you do need to save some reserves for the coda, never mind the finale. But is it quite enough?

Lovely flowing pulse through the middle movements, those wind/string colours wonderfully fresh, light, varied. Attentively shaded dynamics through the trio, and - what beautiful songful horns!
You’ll find the brass better blended here than in the modern/historical hybrid Heidelberg Orchestra.

Does it all get a bit too much, this delicacy, beauty, refinement? Well, perhaps, yes, for some ears, minds and hearts….or moods.
But the finale rushes in unequivocally, fast and energetic, yet allowing these wonderful players time for effortless articulacy at speed (the contrast with on-the-edge Fey is telling, but - maybe you’ll prefer, sometimes, a performance on the ragged edge? Sometimes - definitely!). But…. even here, I was still left wanting more….

***
Which, with Krivine and La Chambre Philharmonique (off the Naive CD, 2006), I pretty much got. You’re immediately aware of more going on - livelier more swinging rhythms, brighter tones and timbres, more vivid characterisation of each mood and melody. The sound isn't far from the Freiburgers, but how much more involving; more acoustic space around the orchestra too, greater sonic immediacy and freshness. (Recorded sound is exceptional in its presence and realism here). What joyful winds!

There isn’t the sheer beauty of sound that Heras-Casado draws from the FB, but the sharper-tipped expressiveness is more than compensatory.
A keener poignancy in the andante and minuet….a haunting, poetic diminuendo in the andante’s coda…..(I was reminded a little here of the similar passage in Bruckner’s 4th).

Krivine, whipping up a wind-and-brass-led Mediterranean storm in the finale impresses by keeping subsidiary ideas and countermelodies unusually clear, but - always an inherent part of the musical line. A touch slower than Heras-Casado, but with even subtler dynamics and greater kick and weight, this makes for a 4th almost the equal of his even finer, overwhelmingly exultant Reformation on the same album.

Certainly one for the shortlist…

[jayne lee wilson]

And on this day my winner is.....

Back to modern instruments with COE/Yannick-Nézet-Séguin, (DGCD 2016, from the Complete Cycle, also 24/96 on Qobuz), and it isn’t long before you think this is something truly special…..
Warm, springy and jaunty opening, smiling yet wistful second group, subtle dynamic inflexions varying the repeat - then a very dramatic, powerfully-articulated development and a thrilling coda with many subtle expressive emphases, natural but telling rubato… listen to the leadback, how no instrumental detail is missed, the phrasing subtly caressed, yet all adding to the flow-through of the symphonic structure. COE are always a joy to the ear in themselves, and what wonderful winds they have, especially the principal clarinet; but even they are playing above themselves here!

This is wholeheartedly true of the whole performance, to which YNS brings his so-characteristic generosity of spirit, such wit and warmth, but always that marvellously vivifying attention to instrumental and expressive detail, bar-to-bar. With glorious recorded sound and the freedom and spontaneity of the live performance, the palpable untrammelled joy of the finale, this is more than just one for the shortlist - it is simply one of the finest Italian Symphonies you’ll ever hear, stunningly true to letter and spirit of this lovable piece but individually responsive too, and you shouldn’t need comparisons to perceive that.

Of all the recent 4ths I’ve heard over the last few days (and the last few years) it’s the one I feel the keenest desire to return to. Gosh, it’s wonderful.

[Barbirollians]

1948 Halle/Barbirolli - Memoir Classics - marvellous springy rhythms and an Italian getting to the heart of the Italian.

[gurnemanz]

Going through recordings I have ... Just enjoyed an Italian in the Italian - Toscanini from 1954, producing fresh, vivid and youthful sounds aged 87, just weeks before his retirement. Sonics are thin but acceptable and no 1st movement repeat. A great listen but most likely not to figure in the BaL shortlist.

[Goon525]

I tend to keep away from larger symphony orchestras in this repertoire now, but It’s still unusual for me to take so negatively against a recording as I did to the Philharmonia/Sinopoli (1984, DG, via Qobuz Studio), largely on account of the very slow tempi in the middle movements. The con moto moderato (more of an andante senza motivo here) seems interminable at 8’16, all the worse for an inflexible uniformity of phrase and pace.

The outer movements fare better, but for all the fineness of the playing, there seems nothing especially distinctive about them to these ears. The tempi are very steady, and the 1st movement’s 2nd group seems very bland in this account. It just goes along…, and without much variance in the repeat, which for once seems once too often. A lack of micro-dynamic subtlety too, which is one of the especial gains in HIPPS and chamber orchestral readings, strikingly so with Heras-Casado - of which more later.
(I was amused to find EG in the Gramophone review describing Sinopoli as setting "a dangerously fast tempo" for the first movement. Tempora Mutantur....)

Sorry to its admirers here but at least I gave it a try..!

Perhaps this should have been a twofer!

[Goon525]

Egged on by JLW's really excellently written reviews, I have this morning listened to both Sinopoli and YN-S. Now, I was one of those raving about Sinopoli higher up this thread, but I guess the honest truth is that I might not have listened to this Italian in twenty-odd years. (I have listened to the Schubert 8 coupling, which I like very much, although it would never be a library recommendation - too Brucknerian and out of its time. But well worth hearing.) I still like the Sinopoli Italian more than Jayne, but would accept that there's one thing that rules it out of consideration - far too slow a tempo for the third movement. In the other movements, I don't think the differences are that great - in fact I think in the first Sinopoli's steadier tempo could be argued to maintain the momentum better than YN-S's tendency to stop and smell the roses. The '80s DG recording is perfectly decent, and certainly doesn't get in the way, but it certainly lacks the transparency of...

The recent YN-S with the COE is a very different approach to a full symphony orchestra, and either way might be a legitimate preference. The recording is a beautifully open and transparent one, particularly via Qobuz at 96/24 - DG seem to have entered a golden age of orchestral recording quality, best heard in Nelsons' Shostakovich recordings in Boston (though also his Bruckner in Leipzig), which are some of the best recordings of orchestras I've heard - and coming from a major, not a specialist audiophile company. This Mendelssohn is also first class. Performance-wise, it's very good indeed, though I do wonder whether YN-S's rose-smelling might ultimately get in the way of it becoming the top recommendation. We shall see.

Many thank to Jayne for inspiring my listening session!

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Perhaps this should have been a twofer!

It probably will be.

[jayne lee wilson]

So after feeling so overwhelmed by Nézet-Séguin…. I was surprised just how well LSO/JEG (LSO Live 2016, 24/192 download WAV files) stood up to the competiton.
Less overtly expressive or varied, and with a less distinctive orchestral character - but in sound of startling presence and clarity (Barbican has its drawbacks but this is the best I’ve heard on LSO Live…the hi-res sound really helps here, it actually verges on the beautiful…in the Barbican, really?!) you’re immediately impressed by the precision and (very) controlled energy, the typically emphatic JEG crispness and attack; yes, it’s all on a tight minimal-vibrato leash, but there’s no lack of warmth or expressiveness in the middle movements - the very purity, balance and blend of winds/strings is striking and a pleasure in itself, dynamic and phrase are not so much measured as micromanaged, and produces a keen tonal plangency from allowing the music to speak very directly for itself. You find yourself relishing the very sound of it - individual notes or chords.

In the finale though, JEG doesn’t hold back - this just takes off from the start, hits top gear and stays there, the rhythms hammered out with great force, definition and drive, producing one of the fastest and most exciting on record. The LSO truly relish their own virtuosity, flutes especially, effortless precise at very high speed, but joyful with it. Again that strictly-disciplined, micromanaged precision of rhythm and dynamic, but here at a breathtaking pace. Quite an experience!

(NB G-525 - not much time for rose-smelling in this one...)