BaL 11.06.11 - Mahler: Des Knaben Wunderhorn

[Barbirollians]

It got rather lukewarm reviews but I have to admit to enjoying the Kozena/Gerhaher/Boulez record more than my only other version which is the Schwarzkopf/DFD /Szell but I am afraid I struggle with both their vocal styles - Szell's conducting is brilliant

[verismissimo]

My first Wonderhorn was Janet Baker and Geraint Evans with the LPO/Wyn Morris, and I still love it, though Evans finds his part a bit of a stain. Then Schwarzkopf and DFD with LSO/Szell - prefer her to him. Then Jessye Norman and Shirley Quirk with Concertgebouw/Haitink. Then Lucia Popp and Bernd Weikl with LPO/Tennstedt. And DFD with pianist Barenboim. A lot of superb performances - and only the Szell currently available?

Much earlier, individual song recordings by Grete Stuckgold, Karin Branzell, Lula Mysz-Gmeiner and Heinrich Schlusnus.

[verismissimo]

Famous German concert mezzo, Lula Mysz-Gmeiner (see above), had sung in the première of Mahler’s Eighth Symphony in 1911. In addition to being the teacher, somewhat briefly, of Schwarzkopf, she also taught Marianne Mathy. At the Sydney Conservatorium from 1954, Mathy’s pupils included June Bronhill, John Cameron and Clifford Grant. So the torch is passed.

[tom_960]

Schwarzkopf/DFD/Szell for me - she does some things that are so amazing that I can forgive and forget any stylistic criticisms. The end of "Der Schildwache Nachtlied", for example. They do that and a few other songs as duets: I suspect that's a bit of a liberty. Anyone know what the score says?

Gerhaher and Kozena sounds tempting though, as long as Boulez's conducting isn't too intellectual and cool.

[gurnemanz]

Gerhaher and Kozena sounds tempting though, as long as Boulez's conducting isn't too intellectual and cool.

Some reviews were ecstatic. Grauniad was lukewarm:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2010/sep/23/mahler-des-knaben-wunderhorn-review/print

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

(This posting was utter rubbish. I've deleted it.)

[remdataram]

Judging by the Thielemann Beethoven DVD's the VPO is still massively male dominated. Watching them is like going backwards in time!

Anyway, thank you for all of your input on this eagerly awaited review - and all the other BAL's.

[aeolium]

Judging by the Thielemann Beethoven DVD's the VPO is still massively male dominated. Watching them is like going backwards in time!

Here is an article written a few years back about VPO employment practices (there is also a more recent update as of early 2010 re the numbers of women players in the VPO). A pretty poor state of affairs, imv.

[remdataram]

Here is an article written a few years back about VPO employment practices (there is also a more recent update as of early 2010 re the numbers of women players in the VPO). A pretty poor state of affairs, imv.

Thank you, Aeolum, very interesting.

You'd think that the VPO must be behaving illegally - it's almost tempting to boycott their recordings; but then I would be descending to their level and depriving myself of music and performances that I love.

There's just something about these Austrians........

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I know this is going a bit off-topic, but have you noticed that the gender ratio of the Halle is the reverse of the VPO?

[Nick Armstrong]

she does some things that are so amazing that I can forgive and forget any stylistic criticisms.

[verismissimo]

What a pity that Boulez's conducting so pedestrian on the extract played. Gerhaher excellent. Hope he records it again.

Wonderful singing and playing in Connolly/Herreweghe. Is this to be the "winner"?

[umslopogaas]

Post 11 LeMartinPecheur, my apologies for not responding to your question, I've only just revisited this thread and spotted it. Alas I know nothing of the Forrester/Rehfuss V.Festival O. Prohaska recording except what I got from Google, where I discovered the reference. Presumably it said mono, but as you point out, if you've got a copy from 1968, it would have been made in stereo too. I think the companies were still making mono versions around that date, but it was ten years after the commercial release of stereo and mono equipment was increasingly replaced by stereo (as an impoverished student with only one loudspeaker, I mopped up loads of mono LPs in delection sales, where they were very cheap). I just had a re-run on Google, but failed to find it again.

The Lorna Sydney, Alfred Poell and V. State Opera O. with Prohaska is definitely mono only, on a two disc set from Nixa: that is the one I've got. The discs are undated, but the cover design looks early nineteen fifties.

[LeMartinPecheur]

Oh dear, the programme has convinced me I really need a new version

I started with Schwarzkopf/DFD/Szell on LP, and still love it. Except for DFD and ES that is I've always had a problem with him (in all repertoire I'm afraid), but today's examples really showed up how she is so often an unappealing mixture of schoolma'am and over-self-conscious diva.

On CD I have Baker/Evans/Morris (never among the most elegant versions though IMO still treasurable for JB's work, and GE's intentions at least), plus Hampson/Parsons which was quickly dismissed as bland.

But which current version to pick? I was impressed with the Herreweghe, the Abbado and the Bernstein.

I think I'd prefer a version without any duet-versions of individual songs. Can anyone say which of these versions avoids them most? Wigmore implied that Mahler expected only one singer per song: does anyone know when the fashion for duet-versions started? Szell and Morris both have them, though without complete agreement on which songs get the treatment.

Also, is there any clarity in the scores, or in GM's writings and practice, on how the songs should be allocated between male and female voice? OK the military ones (Revelge, Der Schildwache Nachtlied, Der Tamboursg'sell) are probably self-selecting as male songs, but as far as I can see the others all get done both ways.

All assistance gratefully received!

[LeMartinPecheur]

Post 11 LeMartinPecheur, my apologies for not responding to your question, I've only just revisited this thread and spotted it. Alas I know nothing of the Forrester/Rehfuss V.Festival O. Prohaska recording except what I got from Google, where I discovered the reference. Presumably it said mono, but as you point out, if you've got a copy from 1968, it would have been made in stereo too. I think the companies were still making mono versions around that date, but it was ten years after the commercial release of stereo and mono equipment was increasingly replaced by stereo (as an impoverished student with only one loudspeaker, I mopped up loads of mono LPs in delection sales, where they were very cheap). I just had a re-run on Google, but failed to find it again.

The Lorna Sydney, Alfred Poell and V. State Opera O. with Prohaska is definitely mono only, on a two disc set from Nixa: that is the one I've got. The discs are undated, but the cover design looks early nineteen fifties.

Umslopogaas: no worries about a reply - Reinerfan in #12 had confirmed that it's stereo. I'd forgotten I had this recording in my previous message about duet-versions (even though it was on the desk as I typed it ). The track listings indicate it is one singer per song. So had the fashion for duets not yet started in 1963? Was it Szell/Legge/EMI's bright idea perchance? [Edit: it wasn't their idea. The Baker/Evans/Wyn Morris recording does the same trick and it's several years older. So did they invent it?]