BaL 24.12.16/10.12.22 - Mozart: Piano Concerto no. 21 in C, K467

[Ein Heldenleben]

I think one of the reasons the spurious title became associated with the concerto in this case was that DG actively marketed Geza Anda's recording as the recording used in the film, complete with a soft focus shot from the film.



Prior to this I believe classical record companies were rather reluctant to associate their recordings with films. As I recall Decca only gave permission for the use of HvK's recording of Also Sprach Zarathustra on the 2001 soundtrack on condition that the film company didn't reveal which recording was used.

Although the Handel Sarabande did become indelibly linked with its use in Barry Lyndon, I don't recall any recordings of it being marketed as "as heard in Barry Lyndon".

Funnily enough, the Jupiter Ensemble played the Sarabande at a concert at the Wigmore Hall last week, and they referenced it as now being one of Handel's most famous pieces thanks to Stanley Kubrick

You’re absolutely right about the Decca Also Sprach Zarathustra. According to John Culshaw , who produced the track , Karajan was so furious about losing out he threatened to sue Decca and MGM - but was placated. This was because other companies got their versions on the market sooner and made the bulk of the money - even though Kubrick had chosen Karajan for the film.
Culshaw thinks it was an example of Decca’s decline. By the eighties you had to get explicit permission to use any commercial classical recording in a title sequence of a movie or tv show. When I complained that it was yet more bureaucracy I was told it wasn’t because the record companies were trying to stop you - they just wanted tipping off so they could increase the pressing runs. The Decca mistake over 2001 had been noticed by all the other majors.

[Nick Armstrong]

I may recall this totally incorrectly but are Rumpole and Uchida not great mates meeting regularly at the bicycle repair shop …… ?????

Not totally incorrectly, anton… the meeting happened once at a bicycle shop long since gone

Thanks to Alison for highlighting my earlier post about the version Prof. Loges selected on Saturday. I’ll give it another listen on the Sunday evening programme, see if my ears have changed in the intervening 6 years…

[Barbirollians]

Not totally incorrectly, anton… the meeting happened once at a bicycle shop long since gone

Thanks to Alison for highlighting my earlier post about the version Prof. Loges selected on Saturday. I’ll give it another listen on the Sunday evening programme, see if my ears have changed in the intervening 6 years…

Have listened again and I don't think the Anda is bland albeit perhaps a little less searching in the famous slow movement than others. Which is ironic considering the chocolate box images of the film. Though considering its grim ending ...

[HighlandDougie]

I'm a bit confused here. HvK lost out in relation to the soundtrack because the version in the film is Böhm's with the Berlin Philharmonic so Decca wasn't involved, other than possibly to refuse permission?

[silvestrione]

I'm a bit confused here. HvK lost out in relation to the soundtrack because the version in the film is Böhm's with the Berlin Philharmonic so Decca wasn't involved, other than possibly to refuse permission?

?? First time I've heard that. It's always been widely reported as HvK/VPO, hasn't it, e.g. currently on Wikipedia.

[Bryn]

I'm a bit confused here. HvK lost out in relation to the soundtrack because the version in the film is Böhm's with the Berlin Philharmonic so Decca wasn't involved, other than possibly to refuse permission?

Not so. The recording used in the film was, indeed, the Karajan. However, the so-called official MGM soundtrack album substituted the Böhm, along with some other substitutions. See, for instance. the "Album release" section of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001:_...y_(soundtrack)

[Nick Armstrong]

Not so much the earlier EMI/Warner recording but the multi-award-winning MDG set is one of my favourite recordings with modern instruments.

Agreed, I collected all these - probably my favourite ‘recent’ versions too. They never seem to get much of a mention though

I must say that the Primakov version excerpts played on BAL caught my ear - I shall definitely be investigating further.

[HighlandDougie]

Not so. The recording used in the film was, indeed, the Karajan. However, the so-called official MGM soundtrack album substituted the Böhm, along with some other substitutions. See, for instance. the "Album release" section of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001:_...y_(soundtrack)

Ah! Thanks Bryn. I'm sure that I should have known that it was HvK on the actual soundtrack, rather than the Böhm but I know now. Not, alas, a favourite piece of music chez moi, although I do seem to have acquired a fair number of recordings, including Böhm and HvK. Despite the nervousness about it being kept quiet that it was the Karajan/VPO, I wonder if he collected royalties for its use.

[Mal]

Have listened again and I don't think the Anda is bland albeit perhaps a little less searching in the famous slow movement than others. Which is ironic considering the chocolate box images of the film. Though considering its grim ending ...

I agree, I think Anda is good and his version made my main playlist - he got bumped off it by Brendel and Perahia, though! It also inspired me to listen to his full box set, and I much preferred Anda to Perahia in several performances, especially in the early concertos.

[LHC]

You’re absolutely right about the Decca Also Sprach Zarathustra. According to John Culshaw , who produced the track , Karajan was so furious about losing out he threatened to sue Decca and MGM - but was placated. This was because other companies got their versions on the market sooner and made the bulk of the money - even though Kubrick had chosen Karajan for the film.
Culshaw thinks it was an example of Decca’s decline. By the eighties you had to get explicit permission to use any commercial classical recording in a title sequence of a movie or tv show. When I complained that it was yet more bureaucracy I was told it wasn’t because the record companies were trying to stop you - they just wanted tipping off so they could increase the pressing runs. The Decca mistake over 2001 had been noticed by all the other majors.

It seems that Decca didn’t learn from the 2001 debacle for some time.

I recently saw an interview with Walter Murch, the Sound Editor on many of Coppola’s films including The Godfather and Apocalypse Now.

When they were editing the helicopter raid in Apocalypse Now in 1979, Coppola chose Solti’s recording of the Ride of the Valkyrie. Murch agreed that this recording provided the ideal mix of excitement, terror and beauty for the scene. However, a few weeks before the scheduled premiere of the film, they realised that they had forgotten to get permission to use the recording. They contacted Decca, but to their dismay, Decca said ‘NO’.

Having been told they couldn’t use the Solti recording, Murch went out and bought all the recordings of Die Walkure he could find, in the hope of finding an alternative they could use for the film. He listened to the 18 other recordings, but none worked as well as the Solti, which he and Coppola regarded as the gold standard. Eventually, Coppola got hold of Solti’s phone number and rang him to ask permission to use his recording. Solti agreed immediately, and said to Coppola “yes of course dear boy, but you really should have come to me first.”

[Ein Heldenleben]

It seems that Decca didn’t learn from the 2001 debacle for some time.

I recently saw an interview with Walter Murch, the Sound Editor on many of Coppola’s films including The Godfather and Apocalypse Now.

When they were editing the helicopter raid in Apocalypse Now in 1979, Coppola chose Solti’s recording of the Ride of the Valkyrie. Murch agreed that this recording provided the ideal mix of excitement, terror and beauty for the scene. However, a few weeks before the scheduled premiere of the film, they realised that they had forgotten to get permission to use the recording. They contacted Decca, but to their dismay, Decca said ‘NO’.

Having been told they couldn’t use the Solti recording, Murch went out and bought all the recordings of Die Walkure he could find, in the hope of finding an alternative they could use for the film. He listened to the 18 other recordings, but none worked as well as the Solti, which he and Coppola regarded as the gold standard. Eventually, Coppola got hold of Solti’s phone number and rang him to ask permission to use his recording. Solti agreed immediately, and said to Coppola “yes of course dear boy, but you really should have come to me first.”

Didn’t Decca also turn down the Beatles saying “guitar groups are on the way out .” ?
Arguably the most costly piece of criticism and review in history.

[LHC]

Didn’t Decca also turn down the Beatles saying “guitar groups are on the way out .” ?
Arguably the most costly piece of criticism and review in history.

Yes they did!

That reminds me of the MGM talent scout who turned down Fred Astaire after his first screen test with the damning comment “Can’t act. Slightly bald. But can dance a little.”