BaL 27.02.16 - Mozart: Requiem Mass in D minor K.626

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

My favourite by some considerable distance is the recording with the Dresden Staatskapelle conducted by Peter Schreier. It was a Gramophone Award winner back in the day (1984, I think) and if you are not moved beyond measure by Margaret Price's glorious soprano voice then all I can say is that you have a heart of stone.

A truly great recording.

Yes, it is extremely good. I have it in the Philips Complete Mozart Edition. Margaret Price is one of my all-time favourite sopranos.

[richardfinegold]

I think I'm going to resign.

You deserve a raise

[richardfinegold]

I bought the Hogwood a few decades ago. Not a note of Sussy in it, and that's the way I like it.

A few years ago, we saw a local Orchestra perform it in a Church on a Sunday afternoon. My Catholic wife complained later "If I had known what the Concert was going to be, I would have skipped Church this morning!"

[BBMmk2]

I recently bought the DVD of Abbado conducting the Req. Very good and also in that mammoth box of Sacred Music, from HM, Herreweghe?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I recently bought the DVD of Abbado conducting the Req. Very good and also in that mammoth box of Sacred Music, from HM, Herreweghe?

Oh yes - that is a beautiful performance and recording. I would imagine Abbado's reading would be fascinating, too, Bbm, and ...

Hold on!

WHO ARE YOU AND WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH THE REAL BBM????!!!

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Hold on!

WHO ARE YOU AND WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH THE REAL BBM????!!!

I'm beginning to feel isolated.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I'm beginning to feel isolated.

Oh, Alpie - why? We all love you

[waldo]

Gardiner for me - a revelation and remains much my favourite 25 years on.

Me, too. I have dozens of recordings of the requiem, but none of them ever come close for me. As for Sussmayr's "contributions", I must have worse ears than some people on this site. To me, it is all glorious music and I can't say I really notice the difference between the hand of the master and the hand of the apprentice. I particularly like the Benedictus, which seems to have been 100% Sussmayr.

I am not convinced, anyway, that contemporary musicologists can do a better job than the man who was there in 1791 - the man who knew Mozart well and who was thoroughly steeped in the idioms of the day. Also a successful composer during his short life: not quite the bungling clown we are often presented with now.

For me, however, the Sussmayr completion just is the Requiem. There is no room in my heart or mind for another version. I grew up listening to it long before I knew anything about its troubled history or alternative versions. I can only listen to other versions as curiosities.

[french frank]

As for Sussmayr's "contributions", I must have worse ears than some people on this site. To me, it is all glorious music and I can't say I really notice the difference between the hand of the master and the hand of the apprentice. I particularly like the Benedictus, which seems to have been 100% Sussmayr.

Just what I feel. At the Benedictus, there does seem to be an 'airiness' which says 'Mozart has gone' - but I assume he's still communicating with Süssmayr And thank goodness for useless ears!

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I particularly like the Benedictus, which seems to have been 100% Sussmayr.

Isn't there a sketch of the opening phrase in Mozart's hand?

[waldo]

Isn't there a sketch of the opening phrase in Mozart's hand?

According to the notes in my Norrington/Druce version, the opening phrase comes from K453b, the exercise book for Barbara Ployer. Whether Sussmayr knew that or was directed to it by Mozart or was handed it on a scrap of paper or Mozart hummed it to him on his death bed or Sussmayr just made it up himself, without ever knowing it.........who knows?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Me, too. I have dozens of recordings of the requiem, but none of them ever come close for me. As for Sussmayr's "contributions", I must have worse ears than some people on this site. To me, it is all glorious music and I can't say I really notice the difference between the hand of the master and the hand of the apprentice. I particularly like the Benedictus, which seems to have been 100% Sussmayr.

IIRC, Brahms shared your attitude - given the opportunity to produce an edition of the Requiem, he decided that he couldn't "improve" on the Sussmayr. I don't think that his ears were particularly poor. And, FWIW, I share your preference for the Sussmayr - there a "dip" in quality (most notably I feel in the Sanctus - the bit that needs most "help" from conductors and performers) but his dedication to the task brought out the best in his not inconsiderable skills. And, yes, the Benedictus is as good as we can expect - so is much of the Agnus Dei, too, I think.

I am not convinced, anyway, that contemporary musicologists can do a better job than the man who was there in 1791 - the man who knew Mozart well and who was thoroughly steeped in the idioms of the day. Also a successful composer during his short life: not quite the bungling clown we are often presented with now.

Yes - I like to hear what others have done with the Music (and I confess here that I don't know at all the version Alpie favours), but there's a huge part of my mind that thinks that, in 50 years time, listeners and performers may well look back on other editions and think "how 1980s"! Sussmayr's completion couldn't be more HIPP!

For me, however, the Sussmayr completion just is the Requiem. There is no room in my heart or mind for another version. I grew up listening to it long before I knew anything about its troubled history or alternative versions. I can only listen to other versions as curiosities.

Plenty of room in many of my own organs - and "curiosities" can stir the imagination - but the Sussmayr has such biographical importance to me (performed it four times, conducted it once, favourite choral work of someone important to me) that it is my "preferred listen".

[Petrushka]

I see there's no Harnoncourt version in Alpie's very long list. As well as the Schreier, my favourite, I greatly enjoy the live 2003 Concentus Musicus Wien/Harnoncourt recording that also includes the original manuscript as a CD ROM track on the disc. Christine Schäfer isn't quite as good as Margaret Price but is excellent nonetheless.

Other versions on my shelves come from VPO/Böhm, all of Karajan's, NYPO/Bruno Walter and VPO/Solti live on 5/12/1991 which I think is the one Padraig refers to above.

Agree very much with Waldo and others regarding Süssmayr.

A pity that Bernard Haitink has never recorded (or performed?) the work.

[Barbirollians]

I would refer forumites back to the very moving Tales from the Stave on iplayer radio . There an interesting point is made , I think by the Austrian contributor that he believes there is quite a lot of Mozart in Sussmayr's work on the requiem because Sussmayr's never wrote anything else of similar quality . I have never heard any of Sussmayr's other work - anyone heard some?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

A pity that Bernard Haitink has never recorded (or performed?) the work.

I think that it was mentioned on one of the Forum's many Mahler#10 threads, that BH won't perform the Requiem for the same reasons that he doesn't perform any version of the Mahler #10. I don't know how true this is.