The Rademann is available on Qobuz if you search hard enough!
BaL 6.01.24 - Haydn: The Creation
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Originally posted by silvestrione View PostDisappointingly, the Accentus CDs are a long wait, for some reason. And the Presto download does not have a digital booklet...
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Originally posted by silvestrione View PostThe Rademann is available on Qobuz if you search hard enough!
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I'm a Qobuz subscriber and while I admire the range of recordings and the sound quality of the offering the UI is unacceptably poor. Moreover, it is perfectly correct to criticise an app which sells directly to English speakers on the fact that the software does not automatically translate German (or any other language) into English. Furthermore, it is random as to how it works. For example, a search of "Haydn Creation" brought up at least 50 recordings, the majority of which are in the German and have "Die schöpfung" as their title. Almost all apps or software which have a global business apply some form of AI to auto translate original languages into English and vice versa. Try Googling "Wienerwald" for example. The majority of your search will bring up Vienna Woods in the results. It should not be up to the customer to have to translate every single work into the original language in order to come up with the required result. For one thing, it is bad business practice. I know how to use Qobuz and have learned to accept its vagaries in return for what I consider to be superior product, but another customer will give up and, what's worse, will likely give up on Qobuz and go to Spotify of Apple Music where they will have a better experience.
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Originally posted by Sir Velo View PostI know how to use Qobuz and have learned to accept its vagaries in return for what I consider to be superior product, but another customer will give up and, what's worse, will likely give up on Qobuz and go to Spotify of Apple Music where they will have a better experience.
The thing that most annoys me is the frankly crass track listing approach: where a recording has multiple works and/or multiple composers, tracks tend to get just their ‘allegro con brio’ (or whatever) heading, with inconsistent indications of which piece they’re in (the recent Hans Gál Concertinos recording http://open.qobuz.com/album/s8np2ndqmkvsa is a prime offender )"...the isle is full of noises,
Sounds and sweet airs, that give delight and hurt not.
Sometimes a thousand twangling instruments
Will hum about mine ears, and sometime voices..."
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Originally posted by gurnemanz View Post
CDs out stock at UK distributor Naxos. Amazon UK have it as an import from Greece. German dealer jpc is offering immediate delivery. Lack of booklet at Presto is a deterrent to purchase and has the drawback for many of only containing the German text. I'm going to make do with Spotify. I can use the text and translation from another set, but these can easily be found online.
For my part, I was sorry not to have heard a mention of the big band Hogwood version in English on the programme. But I agree with others on here, a very good BAL indeed.
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Although JS said that he had a marginal preference for English over German as the language for the work, all but two of his selections used the German text, even those featuring native English speakers as soloists. Neither of the English versions reached his final selection, however. Given that the English text was the original text, which Haydn had translated into German for Viennese audiences, I would have liked to have seen more consideration of English versions and a recommendation for an English version (of the two sampled I have a marginal preference for Christophers). Given that more continental singers are now prepared to sing English texts in a variety of contexts and even more speak the language fluently, perhaps conductors should encourage them to sing the English version, ie The Creation rather than Die Schöpfung?
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Originally posted by CallMePaul View PostAlthough JS said that he had a marginal preference for English over German as the language for the work, all but two of his selections used the German text, even those featuring native English speakers as soloists. Neither of the English versions reached his final selection, however. Given that the English text was the original text, which Haydn had translated into German for Viennese audiences, I would have liked to have seen more consideration of English versions and a recommendation for an English version (of the two sampled I have a marginal preference for Christophers). Given that more continental singers are now prepared to sing English texts in a variety of contexts and even more speak the language fluently, perhaps conductors should encourage them to sing the English version, ie The Creation rather than Die Schöpfung?
A recent, very peculiar example was the first CD recording of Ethel Smyth's early opera, the vocal score of which features the original English text and the German translation in which it was first performed, as well as the dual title The Forest - Der Wald. Although even Covent Garden had done it in English, as The Forest, the excellent recording - although mercifully sung in English - insisted on titling the CD Der Wald, as if giving it a foreign name made it a more respectable opera. It's a strange world, where English loses out both ways.
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Originally posted by CallMePaul View PostGiven that the English text was the original text, which Haydn had translated into German for Viennese audiences ...
Here's a quote from a very thorough online analysis I came across:
It is clear that, although Swieten endeavoured to keep the two texts similar in metre, Haydn composed to the German text and made rhythmic modifications to accommodate the English text at a later stage. It is hard to make a satisfactory case for any of the musical numbers having been composed initially to the English text, even in those parts - the Biblical quotations from Genesis - which have reached us unaltered. In every case the German flows better, as is to be expected from a German-speaker whose English was admittedly poor.
source
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Originally posted by gurnemanz View PostHere's a quote from a very thorough online analysis I came across:
It is clear that, although Swieten endeavoured to keep the two texts similar in metre, Haydn composed to the German text and made rhythmic modifications to accommodate the English text at a later stage. It is hard to make a satisfactory case for any of the musical numbers having been composed initially to the English text, even in those parts - the Biblical quotations from Genesis - which have reached us unaltered. In every case the German flows better, as is to be expected from a German-speaker whose English was admittedly poor.
source
Prejudice against any English-language setting (especially from German critics keen to 'reclaim' the work) lies at the root of this particular Snark hunt. The reality is more complex, and far more interesting!
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I recall my fellow music students organising a surprise party for my 21st birthday. They had also clubbed together to buy me the Bernstein/CBS recording of The Creation. I was struck by their generosity, but was a little disappointed by the recorded balance - artificially close soloists and a somewhat “hard” choral sound. But the most annoying thing was the rather obvious pre-echo on the LP just before the mighty splendour of the word “light” in the opening recit and chorus.
Later, I was to buy the Munchinger/Decca recording, which is superb in every way.
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