BaL 28.03.15 - Elgar: Symphony no. 2 in E flat

[Alison]

Yeah, come on Barbs. Where are you?

Just an average BaL I'd say which somehow failed to communicate the full scope of the work, the various musical issues seemingly rather black and white.

My local HMV has a couple of copies of the Barenboim; think Ill take advantage of Monday's airing before taking the plunge.

A commendable about turn from Mr Caliban, I must say

[knodge41]

A few months ago I saw on TV the Simon Bolivar Orchestra (!) tackling Elgar 2 and was absolutely fascinated as it seemed such an unlikely choice. Interviews with some of the young performers revealed that they had become true converts to the work.

There is a link to a performance of the first movement of the Symphony, under the baton of Natalia Luis-Bassa on vk.com (a sort of Russian YouTube site):

http://vk.com/video-6696028_144890187

It might be worth hearing Dudamel doing this, perhaps?

[akiralx]

A few months ago I saw on TV the Simon Bolivar Orchestra (!) tackling Elgar 2 and was absolutely fascinated as it seemed such an unlikely choice. Interviews with some of the young performers revealed that they had become true converts to the work.

There is a link to a performance of the first movement of the Symphony, under the baton of Natalia Luis-Bassa on vk.com (a sort of Russian YouTube site):

http://vk.com/video-6696028_144890187

Luis-Bassa was for quite a few years MD of the amateur Huddersfield PO of which my late father was a member for 30-odd years.

[vinteuil]

... the Oramo sounded appealing, and the Mackerras interesting.

I enjoyed Richard M's description of the various contenders. The parti pris of the various contributors here has been entertaining.

Can't really say that Elgar does much for me.

[vibratoforever]

Richard Morrison is a minor musician and News International journalist. Hence it is no surprise to hear him slagging off much better musicians in the way and with the tone he did. My first Elgar, 60 years ago was Sargent's LSO Enigma, and has encompassed all the noted interpreters. I include Sinopoli amongst them, and his Enigma recording I find enthralling. Adverse comments on his Elgar 2 performance are fine but the sneering superior tone are not. And why waste valuable time by including 2 excerpts of such a dire effort, if that is what it is?
Then, irony of ironies, his final selection seemingly being chosen on the non-musical grounds that its performers are "not English"! You could not make it up!

As for how many of the available versions Morrison listened to, not to say whether in part or full, I suspect the % is low.

[akiralx]

My local HMV has a couple of copies of the Barenboim; think Ill take advantage of Monday's airing before taking the plunge.

A commendable about turn from Mr Caliban, I must say

I decided a while ago after listening to it that I wouldn't be getting the Barenboim - this BaL hasn't changed that. I'll stick to Tate, Thomson, Oramo and Haitink (I've clearly nothing against modern or non-UK conductors…)

[cloughie]

Was any mention made of Barenboim's 70s LPO recording? - I seem to remember criticism of its exaggerated portamento at the time of its release. My preferences are Barbirolli and Thompson - giving the music room to breathe.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

The earlier Barenboim was mentioned in passing, Cloughie, as an introduction to the new recording to illustrate the conductor's career-long interest in the composer.

I prefer those performances that follow the composer's lead and emphasize the momentum and drive of the Music - leaving the audience gasping for breath

[seabright]

If memory serves, and assuming I'm not mistaken, the Downes / BBC PO Naxos CD was top choice the last time Elgar 2 was surveyed on BAL. This time it didn't even get a mention! I am happy to be corrected however.

[Alison]

Good to see favourable mentions for Sinopli and Haitink; they may not be library winning performances but have much to add to the appreciation of this anything but one dimensional work. I shall seek these out today.

Quite a few mentions for Thomson so that is one to get to know.

On YouTube recent Proms renditions of some stature from Harding and Petrenko are well worth seeking out. So too Frank Shipway and the Sao Paulo orchestra.

[visualnickmos]

If memory serves, and assuming I'm not mistaken, the Downes / BBC PO Naxos CD was top choice the last time Elgar 2 was surveyed on BAL. This time it didn't even get a mention! I am happy to be corrected however.

I think you are absolutely right. It is a superb version. As is Andrew Davis with the BBC SO (which did get a mention) which is in my top 3 Elgar seconds.....

Was an OK-ish BaL - if one gets past the "madman in Kew Gardens with a chainsaw" aspect! Many a prized evergreen mercilessly hacked down!

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

Adverse comments on his Elgar 2 performance are fine but the sneering superior tone are not.

That's an interesting observation, vfe. It passed me by during the broadcast, because I agreed with the sentiments he was expressing re the tempo. But on listening to it again, I must agree with you about the sneering tone.

Reviewers should use objectivity rather than the style of the politician.

[BBMmk2]

school holidays, innit!

|yessss!!!

[Petrushka]

Many Forum comments on various recent BaL's, reveal that the format is now increasingly outdated. There are simply too many recordings of most of the repertoire for any reviewer to do more than skim the surface and make a meaningful assessment. The predictable howls of anguish at long treasured versions being brutally discarded only reinforces the point.

BaL is a programme within a programme that is crying to break out of the straitjacket and if I was R3 Controller I'd be thinking of resurrecting Interpretations on Record. The idea of a 'winner' is increasingly ludicrous and IoR will allow listeners to make their own choice and perhaps look at recordings that they barely knew existed.

The Elgar 2, foe example, is full of interpretative detail that can influence our choice quite apart from such basic matters as tempo; is the organ used? is the high trumpet note in the finale held or not? does the percussion overwhelm the rest of the orchestra at the feverish episode in the third movement etc, etc.

[aeolium]

Many Forum comments on various recent BaL's, reveal that the format is now increasingly outdated. There are simply too many recordings of most of the repertoire for any reviewer to do more than skim the surface and make a meaningful assessment. The predictable howls of anguish at long treasured versions being brutally discarded only reinforces the point.

BaL is a programme within a programme that is crying to break out of the straitjacket and if I was R3 Controller I'd be thinking of resurrecting Interpretations on Record. The idea of a 'winner' is increasingly ludicrous and IoR will allow listeners to make their own choice and perhaps look at recordings that they barely knew existed.

I agree. Yesterday's BaL I thought was particularly mean-spirited, a world away from the kind of review that I admire where the reviewer can praise interpretations of very different character rather than dismissing everything that does not fit his rather narrow view of how the work should be performed. And part of the problem - and I think it particularly applies to Elgar's 2nd symphony - is that extracts simply cannot convey a proper understanding of how an interpretation can develop over a whole movement, and the whole work. A tempo that can appear slow from an extract can, if the whole movement is heard, sound completely convincing.

The only information of real interest I gained from yesterday was the study that Mackerras made of Elgar's own recordings so that some of the stylistic detail could be incorporated into his own recording with the RPO, particularly the extensive use of portamento. The Mackerras recording does sound like a genuinely historically informed performance and, unlike the vast majority of HIPP recordings, informed by actual listening to recordings made by the composer. The reviewer seemed pretty dismissive about the composer's recordings as perhaps others have been, put off by the quality of recording and orchestra, but would we really be dismissive if for instance Mahler had lived long enough to put down a recording of one of his symphonies however bad the recording quality?