BaL 31.01.15 - Beethoven: Symphony no. 3 in E flat "Eroica"

[Barbirollians]

I have never quite got the purpose of these transcriptions nowadays . I can understand entirely what benefit they had in the days before recorded sound as it enabled those who could not get to see an orchestral concert to hear or learn the music .

Returning back to the main topic - another performance that was not given a mention was Bruno Walter's account .

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I have never quite got the purpose of these transcriptions nowadays . I can understand entirely what benefit they had in the days before recorded sound as it enabled those who could not get to see an orchestral concert to hear or learn the music .

[Roehre]

I have never quite got the purpose of these transcriptions nowadays . I can understand entirely what benefit they had in the days before recorded sound as it enabled those who could not get to see an orchestral concert to hear or learn the music .

Returning back to the main topic - another performance that was not given a mention was Bruno Walter's account .

They obviously lost their original aims, enabling people to listen to them in an era without many (orchestral) public concerts and without any means to record sound.

Nevertheless I do think they still have a purpose, not only as (re-)creations in themselves, but also to clearify the main harmonic and melodic lines.
Without the Liszt transcription of 9 (the one for one piano without soloists or choir, that is) for me the relation between the structure and approach of the Diabelli variations and ditto of the Ninth's finale would not be that clear.
With it, one does hear immediately the similarities between those two works (and the finales of opp.109 and 111, btw)

[gurnemanz]

Roehre put it better than I might have done. I do hear things I hadn't heard before. Liszt, possibly the greatest pianist ever and composer to boot, lavished a lot of time and effort on his transcriptions, perhaps more than might have been strictly necessary just to produce a usable salon version.

Interesting review of the excellent Cyprien Katsaris set.

[Roehre]

Roehre put it better than I might have done. I do hear things I hadn't heard before. Liszt, possibly the greatest pianist ever and composer to boot, lavished a lot of time and effort on his transcriptions, perhaps more than might have been strictly necessary just to produce a usable salon version.

Interesting review of the excellent Cyprien Katsaris set.

The difference between what Liszt as composer/pianovirtuoso did and what Beethoven himself might have done, is excellently illustrated by the one fragment Beethoven produced as piano-reduction (a salon setting basically): the slow introduction of the 7th symphony. Compared with Liszt's version Beethoven's sounds like a mere sketch. The notes however are essentially the same, but nevertheless Liszt creates a quasi-orchestral sound which Beethoven's reduction lacks.
Listen to CD3 tracks 1 and 2 of this Hyperion/Howard set

[Bryn]

Eagerly awaiting Yury Martynov's recording of the Beethoven/Liszt 9th. His 1st to 8th have been a delight.

[vinteuil]

Eagerly awaiting Yury Martynov's recording of the Beethoven/Liszt 9th. His 1st to 8th have been a delight.

[Roehre]

Eagerly awaiting Yury Martynov's recording of the Beethoven/Liszt 9th. His 1st to 8th have been a delight.

Do you know whether it will be the piano-version or the piano+soloists+choir-version?

[Bryn]

Do you know whether it will be the piano-version or the piano+soloists+choir-version?

Sorry, no. Come to that, of piano+soloists+choir-versions I only know that by Wagner. How does the Liszt compare?

Just about to give Liszt 2 piano version a hearing:

[Roehre]

Sorry, no. Come to that, of piano+soloists+choir-versions I only know that by Wagner. How does the Liszt compare?

Just about to give Liszt 2 piano version a hearing:

I am afraid I don't know, as I never have heard Wagner's version.
But Wagner's is a mere transcription/piano reduction I believe.

[Barbirollians]

I found the BPO/Bohm DG Originals in a charity shop today for £2 - any views ?

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

I found the BPO/Bohm DG Originals in a charity shop today for £2 - any views ?

I never took to the Böhm Beethoven cycle (I had it on LP) in my callow youth - but in the very early 1980s, Richard Osborne described DG as having three of the greatest sets in the catalogue in Karajan (the '70s set), Bernstein and Böhm. I adored the first two - I should give the third another hearing. (Closer to Walter than to Toscanini.)

[silvestrione]

I never took to the Böhm Beethoven cycle (I had it on LP) in my callow youth - but in the very early 1980s, Richard Osborne described DG as having three of the greatest sets in the catalogue in Karajan (the '70s set), Bernstein and Böhm. I adored the first two - I should give the third another hearing. (Closer to Walter than to Toscanini.)

Yes I think I remember that, but wasn't he referring to the Bohm version (cycle) with the VPO?

On LP that was my favourite Eroica...especially memorable horn solo at the recapitulation, etc. I remember it as a long way from Toscanini-intense, more unobtrusively musical and flowing.

[ferneyhoughgeliebte]

Yes I think I remember that, but wasn't he referring to the Bohm version (cycle) with the VPO?

You are absolutely right, of course - I had forgotten that Böhm had recorded it twice.

[Eine Alpensinfonie]

I've only once heard the Eroica played live by a professional orchestra, and that was VPO/Bohm in the RAH. It was rather magnificent, but the encore (Die Meistersinger prelude) was even better.

In general, however, i find Bohm to be rather dull conductor.